This new thread has been started by Petermac with the agreement of those modelling trams from card.

The following posts have been moved here from the "Maxmill Electric Tramway" thread with the agreement of their authors.

wahiba
Full Member


    Joined: Mon Jan 14th, 2013    Location: Keighley, United Kingdom    Posts: 9     Status:  Offline    
Gallery photos        I  too have recently taken to tram modelling. However I have taken an  individualistic approach and designed my own trams! This came about  through looking at ways to produce DIY tinplate when the penny dropped  that it would be a lot easier to print on card. Having acquired a load  of Underground Ernie chassis (is there a plural for chassis - with all  those ss it might look strange?) I quickly realised that I would have to  scratch build bodies and in the interests of speed went down the  printed card route.
I use DeltaCAD to draw up the body and then transfer to DrawPlus for  colouring in. So far I have made a lot of various bodies in various  colours. It is also pretty easy to try different scales. Living as I do  in a once 4 feet gauce zone I generally stay local, use 1/76 scale for 4  feet. I have tried 1/64 S which means 16.5mm represents 3' 6". I have  also made 0, 1 and G gauge bodies. The latter were meant for meccano  chassis and as yet has progressed no where.

Being more interested in the technology than the trams themselves I  discovered the various methods, past and present of wireless electric  trams. I quickly realised that this easily represented by 3 rail track.  Acquiring some Hornby for trials I became a fan of this really lovely  tinplate track. Even making three rail is straight forward thanks to  Peco who provide suitable fittings, and also 'studding' for Marklin  style stud contact - which is actually more realistic of the prototypes  that a continuous third rail - except there is a system in use that  while intermittent looks continuous; Ansaldo I think make this.  Bombardier make an induction system, same method as electric tooth  brushes.

Finally there is the ability with some three rail systems to indulge in a  basic type of automation really suited to tramways. Unfortunately it  does not work with Hornby track but will with Trix Twin, or any system  where the running rails are still insulated from each other. Of course  it also works with and overhead supply. It was seeing a small figure of 8  layout with three trams running on it that introduced me to the  concept.

It is all work in progress but soon hope to have a reasonable demonstration layout for my different approach.

David

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freelance model railways and tramways

The Bankie
Full Member


Joined: Tue Jan 29th, 2013    Location: Bradford, United Kingdom    Posts: 31     Status:  Offline    
Gallery photos        Hi David
I'm not too far from you here in Greengates.
As far  as I am aware the trams never quite got to Keighley. They  stopped in Crossflats but since I was living in Clydebank when the trams  stopped running in Bradford I don't know for certain.
I can not afford to use DeltaCAD, I'm stuck with AUTOCad 2012 so I have  no templates for this kind of work but at least I can make them.

If you are going "freelance" I have a whole set of freebies from here, http://www.brusselspapertrams.be/downloads.html and when I find out how to insert this as a link I will.
I also have some other free downloads which might suit you and since  they are free to download I can put them on here providing I leave the  originators name on the file.
The Brussels jobbies include some spiffiy Bombartier style (need to check to see what they are) and some older four wheel stuff.



The buildings are Scalescenes low relief garages

Regards
Jim


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Because, except in some unfortunate circumstances, trains did not run on town centre streets

wahiba
Full Member


    Joined: Mon Jan 14th, 2013    Location: Keighley, United Kingdom    Posts: 8     Status:  Offline    
Gallery photos        Hi Jim

Actually Keighley also had a 4' tramway. It got as far as Riddlesden or  thereabouts. It was never connected to Bradford although I suspect the  use of 4' gauge meant it was a rounf2it that never happened.

DeltaCad by the way is not an expensive CAD package and for the casual  hobbyist is far easier to learn than AutoCAD. I am now on version 8  having upgraded since I bought the first version about 12 years ago.  When I too had access to AutoCAD I much preferred DeltaCAD.

All I do is save the drawing as a .dxf file and DrawPlus from Serif  loads it OK. All one has to do is make sure the layers are not merged.  Only bit of work before colouring is to put the layers in order.

Thanks for the links, I think I have found some before.

For the most complex card model try Canon and Yamaha - the latter have  card models of motorcycles to download. They are terrifying in there  complexity.

Up to now it has all been playing around and trying out. I am now  getting serious and going to try and produce some real models. Will post  my efforts.

David


____________________
freelance model railways and tramways

The Bankie
Full Member


    Joined: Tue Jan 29th, 2013    Location: Bradford, United Kingdom    Posts: 30     Status:  Offline    
Gallery photos        Hi David
Not a great distance apart then. Mind you there were many local and municipal lines which ended like that.
A word of caution regards the Brussels paper trams. They are fine but  not to scale. I simply resized the entire page in Photoshop since I had  the wheelbase to work from. There isn't much in it but it is noticeable.  If you want current Brittish trams Nottingham have a freebie but it is  nearer N gauge.


____________________
Because, except in some unfortunate circumstances, trains did not run on town centre streets

The Bankie
Full Member


    Joined: Tue Jan 29th, 2013    Location: Bradford, United Kingdom    Posts: 29     Status:  Offline    
Gallery photos        Hi David
Got interupted by a culinary emergency so I’ve had to come back and do this.
Possibly the best card tram kits are from Elena & Robert Hardy at elrokits@btinternet.com   and they are certainly a quick education in what to aim for in a card kit.
So far I have got as far as the pics below with the developement of my  Glasgow stuff and when I have got it to a sensible kit I will go with a  Bradford standard. If you have any plans or pics of the Keighley stuff I  would like to have a look at them.

Standard Tram



Coronation Tram

Regards
Jim


____________________
Because, except in some unfortunate circumstances, trains did not run on town centre streets

wahiba
Full Member


    Joined: Mon Jan 14th, 2013    Location: Keighley, United Kingdom    Posts: 7     Status:  Offline    
Gallery photos        Hi Jim

You are in a different league to me. I have tended towards quantity over  detail: technical note - I have not used the term quality as I  recognise quality as meaning fit for purpose; mine might look rough, be  short of detail and freelance. However they are fit for the purpose.

These are grafic pictures of some of my tram designs. These were all created to fit on old Underground Ernie Chassis.

This is one of my models for cutting out.
A double decker I tried out.




____________________
freelance model railways and tramways

The Bankie
Full Member


    Joined: Tue Jan 29th, 2013    Location: Bradford, United Kingdom    Posts: 28     Status:  Offline    
Gallery photos        Hi David
Can't see anything wrong there. They are up and running and I'm still  developing and hunting for a way of getting bogies or a truck under  mine.
Where are you thinking of running the Aire Valley Tramway from and to?  Keighley to Howarth would be good and you could do a "toastrack" for  summer visitors to Bronte country (assuming we ever get a summer) and  Skipton castle would be a good northern end.
You are not as freelance as you think! Take a look below


The bottom one is Hong Kong

Regards
Jim


____________________
Because, except in some unfortunate circumstances, trains did not run on town centre streets

new04db
Full Member


    Joined: Sun Jan 13th, 2013    Location: Malmesbury, United Kingdom    Posts: 45     Status:  Offline    
Gallery photos        Those  card models are very well made bankie and wahiba, have you ever thought  of printing out your designs on a 3D printer or laser cutter, I know  bankie's designs are made in auto-cad it should be compatible.

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Kind Regards

Aaron

wahiba
Full Member


    Joined: Mon Jan 14th, 2013    Location: Keighley, United Kingdom    Posts: 6     Status:  Offline    
Gallery photos        Good idea. You think you are alone in following an obscure modelling route and then find you are not.

On the topic of CADCAM and 3D printing. Still saving for a 2D CNC card cutter - there is one!


____________________
freelance model railways and tramways


    Gallery photos        Hi Aaron
Yes there are places who deal commercially with 3d printing and I even  know a guy in Bradford who could do laser cutting, BUT, we come back to  price and for small runs you need to pay for everything including the  developement and postage.
Cheapest 3d printer I have found is A$650 and you need to build it when  it arrives from Oz. Don't bother looking up lazer cutters as they tend  to be heavy duty commercial card or fabric cutters and WAAAAAY  overpowered for small scale card cutting.. The "Craft Robo" cutters are  good for plain card designs but have difficulty with coloured designs  due to possible registration errors. I used one and could not get it to  be accurate enough to avoid either white bits or cutting into the  coloured portions of the job. You need a plain black/white template and  then have to use that to cut a coloured print out.
However if you want to use the designs as test pieces for the students:mrgreen:….

I think I'll have another look at "Craft Robo" since it was about 3 years ago I tried one. May be some upgrades.
The final option is a cutting plate like a jigsaw cutter but at around  Â£140 per plate and either of the trams will need four plates I am  looking at £560 for each design:sad:

Regards
Jim


____________________
Because, except in some unfortunate circumstances, trains did not run on town centre streets


    Gallery photos        Hi David
In contact with Jeff at Creative Printers cplsales@print1.co.uk  regards cutter but you need to use a template or you confuse the  machine and it cuts EVERY line. So you need to use the template and  register the two together.

Jim


____________________
Because, except in some unfortunate circumstances, trains did not run on town centre streets    

Hi again David & Aaron
The current result is that CPL say they have a machine capable of cutting the card but have no idea if it will cut the acetate needed for glazing. I could just bout live with that but I feel that if I wait a bit 3D printers might come down in price enough to let me afford one.
I have asked for a quote from a lazer company so will give us all a good laugh later when I get it.

Peter
I like the new position for the avatar.


Regards
Jim

I reckon 3D printers will catch on pretty quickly. There is a "3D pen" about to hit the market, basically a device that extrudes a plastics that hardens just after the nozzle (much the same way sealant out of a tube does for me!!). 3D that printers that use a similar principle will probably hit the market first. There are other 3D printing techniques but I suspect they are still too complex for the home market.

One use of 3D printers is for them to print the model in wax. This can then be used to form a complex lost wax mould. Usually referred to as one of the oldest casting techniques. A film on TV about Rolls Royce showed them using the technique making jet engine components.

As a one time production engineer I am following this technology with some interest. I hope the model industry is too. Airfix could become an information company from who one downloads the model  kit data for ones home 3D printer. I wonder?

David

PS

Now back to my card trams.

Plan of Tram from CAD. Not sure why it has reversed.

I think 3D printing "at home" is still a long way off David - if only because of the costs involved.

If you Google "Grime Street", there's a guy who is marketing some 3D printed Leeds trams for, I think, around the £40-ish mark.

They are wonderful scale models with all details included.  You do of course, still have to add the motor and other "electrical" bits. 

3D Printing at home: Five years - and I think I might be being a bit pessimistic. This requires a non modelling use as well for the mass market but I think it will happen.

I do not usually go in for such precise predictions so I might be way out, but with fast changing technologies it is hard to tell.

David

This is after a line model from CAD has been processed by the drawing package.

Again .gif hence the black background.

Another tram in .png which looks OK.

At the moment my university (UWE) are having a pilot scheme with a 3d printer in the library, very tempted to have a go with it as its free to use at the moment, just gotta wait for it to be free and might have a crack at it, might print out some people or bicycles.

Give it a go Aaron - but don't forget to document it all on here , with photographs if possible. :thumbs

OK Guys
Since we are putting up models here's one I prepared earlier:roll:



As you can see it's a Brussels tram and is a free download from the "Brussels Paper Trams website. I have rescaled it for 00.
Peter this is a free download with permission to copy so there is no copyright infringement providing the source is acknowledged and no charge is made.

The .PDF at http://www.brusselspapertrams.be/7821.html downloads The tram below BUT be warned it is NOT 00 gauge.
Print 7016 out at 1:1 and you will have a 00 gauge tram.




Have fun
Jim