[user=3]Gwent Rail[/user] wrote:

Given that most people's dropper wires are different in diameter to Bus wires (or Common Return wires in DC), would that not preclude the use of snap lock connectors :question 

I thought that these were only useful for joining together wires of the same diameter.

Scotchlok do make one that will accommodate 2 different wire gauges Jeff and they are very good, you don't need any special tools, just pliers to push the sides together and the little flap comes round and locks the 2 sides in place.

Excellent product if you need a quick repair or it is a difficult area to solder in.  I would recommend soldering, but these are an excellent alternative.

Edit - I think each size connector will accommodate a small range of wire gauges sizes e.g. it might take SWG 24 -20

As far as suit case type connectors go, I have used them in the past without problems, even with the wrong tool and two different size wires, but never on a model railway, and when there was a problem ( and there was) it was always immediate, the joint just did not work. Once taken off and done over all worked well.
That said, I will still solder everything primarily because of Jeff's comment about other things needing soldering. If you don't learn it, how can you do those things? Certainly soldering all these joints will give one a lot of experience.
Mine are coming along nicely and should get even better as time goes by. It will be interesting when I finally try to solder to the track. I think that will be the ultimate test.

It's getting close!
Wayne

Did anyone out there hear the sleepers melting? Or maybe even the few choice words after that? :twisted:  :twisted:  :twisted:

I am having a hard time trying to tin my newest soldering iron. It is a 15/30 watt iron with a small pointed tip. When I heat it up (30 watt setting) and touch the solder to it, all the solder just runs around and falls off the tip! It's the one on the right in the next photo. You can see the drops of solder that just fell off. The iron on the left is my trusty old iron (130 watts) that I've had for many years, though not used much! :roll:
So what do I do to get the solder to stick to the tip?



Here is my first attempt at soldering the dropper wire to the rail. I used the 130 watt iron and it did indeed melt four sleepers, very fast I might add. I think I blinked through three of them and didn't even see them melting.


Do they make electric glue?

Wayne

Wayne i use the 30 watt iron,i don`t solder the tip i just heat the rail
then apply the solder to the iron it just runs in.

lol::cool:

OK Wayne, easy one.  The iron has become a bit too hot.  After it cools down, polish the copper tip (sandpaper or a fine file) until it is bright.  Turn it on and apply the resin core solder, wiping it in your wet sponge, as it warms up.  It will soon become shiny with solder.  You might have it turned up a bit high, mine runs at about 300 degrees, celcius.

OK Wayne, here goes   …   this is my method, it works for me, but there'll probably be a zillion of our members that will not like it.
Use the 30w iron, it's the closest you've got. I use a 15w for electrical wiring to rail, that's plenty of heat for a small wire joint and sure as hell won't melt the rail unless you naughtyword about. Use some paste flux (I use Fry's Powerflow) but any good flux recommended for lead free solder  will do.

1) Clean the rail where you want the wire to go, strip 2mm to 3mm sleeving off the end of the wire. Both surfaces are now clean.

2) Use a pointed (cocktail?) stick to put a small dab of flux on the rail, spread some flux onto the bared wire.

3) Gently melt some solder onto your tip (I use a 2.5mm spade end bit) If the solder falls off, you've melted too much off the reel. Place the tip against the flux on the rail and it will hiss as the flux melts and the solder flows. That just took about 3 seconds and if you use a 30w iron and don't touch the plastic with your iron, the sleeper will be intact. Now repeat the process to coat the wire with solder.

4) Allow both to cool, you have just "tinned" both components of the join. Don't forget to "clean" the tip on your wetted sponge after each soldering / tinning move)

5) When cool add a small dab of flux to both the tinned components (wire & rail)

7) Take a very small amount of solder onto your tip, hold the wire against the rail in the position you want it to stick and gently touch the wire with your iron tip. As soon as the solder melts (about 3 seconds), remove the tip but hold the wire in place until it solidifies (another 5 or 6 seconds)

8) When the join is nearly cold, wipe the joint with a damp rag to remove the residual flux.

Congratulations, you just made a sucessful, neat joint.

Now the proffesionals will tell you all sorts of things that are wrong with my method, shouldn't use this, shouldn't use that, don't tin the rail first, apply the solder and heat together etc. etc. Forget the bullshit, my friend, this method is simple, easy to cope with (one function at a time), less messy than most and works.

Wayne, it maybe wrong in "professional" eyes, as per the  method that Jeff has so well described but as he said - it works so you have nothing to lose by trying it. It may sound complicated but it is just one step after another & in time, it becomes automatic like a lot of things we do day in & day out.

Thank You Max and Jeff, now it's back to the layout! :pedal

Wayne

:wow What a forum! I have now completed eight joints with, as I view it, great success. OK, now I know I can do better ( and hopefully will), but for right now I'm elated!

A Big Thank You To Jeff, And Max For Your Help!

I'm still melting sleepers, but only one or two, not four. Probably holding the iron on too long. Here's a few pictures of my efforts (with your help)!








The 30 watt iron is now working great and I may even try it at 15 watts. That just may help with the melting sleepers.

What a GREAT Forum! (Thanks Bob!)
Wayne

Hi Wayne.  You're going well. Could I suggest that you use multi strand wire, rather than solid.  It's softer and will pull around into the hole easier.  It looks like you're getting there.  Don't worry too much about the odd bent tie, the ballasting will cover them.  After you've done the first thousand, it's a breeze!

I'll second Max's suggestion of multi-strand wire, Wayne and add one other comment. I think you would find it easier to have your bare wire slightly shorter.

That will give you the best chance of a small solder deposit on the rail, as my joints are probably half the size of yours. Mind you, when I think back to my first joints, I probably had twice as much as you on the rail, so you're not doing so badly :exclam:exclam

Ok, I'll try and shorten the wire some more. I have already bought the wire for the droppers and it's solid, so that is what I will have to get used to. Actually it's not bad to work with, I can bend it before pulling it down near the rail. I bend it at 90 degrees, then bend that bend 45 degrees towards the rail, so when I pull down on the wire it actually tucks neatly into the hollow of the rail and pretty much stays there. Several of them I didn't even have to clamp to the rail.

The hardest ones I've had to do so far are the ones where I cannot see the side of the rail. They are in from the edge of the baseboard about thirty inches, and my head just won't reach that far!

Wayne

If your head won't reach there, no one else's will either . . .:cool wink

[user=269]MaxSouthOz[/user] wrote:

If your head won't reach there, no one else's will either . . .

Wayne

[user=269]MaxSouthOz[/user] wrote:

If your head won't reach there, no one else's will either . . .:cool wink

Rubber necks may though

Wayne

Reading your latest adventure has brought back memories from wiring our layout, but I wish in a way that I was at your stage again, because I am putting in all the lighting around the layout at the moment, and that means trying to hide loads of wires,as we have already ballasted, something that will be one of the last jobs, on the HO layout.

You are making so much progress , and just think, after this is scenic's,buildings and playing :Happy

Alan,
You bring to mind a question, at what point in the construction of a layout should the lighting wires be installed. Now I know you can't put in the wire going through the baseboards to the buildings and lamp posts, but how about the bus wire for the lights. I've been thinking I should be putting in those wires now also.

I've also been thinking of making a Perry —"To Do List" of the entire layout. Just so I don't forget something in the order that it should be done in. Has anyone ever seen a list like that?

Wayne

I've heard of them Wayne but usually, when you get to "No 15 - run trains", you realise you forgot to put  "No 1(a) - connect wires to track"  in the original list !!!!!

I do however, think that's a very good idea.  An hour or two working through things for each job, satge by stage, can save a hell of a lot of frustration later on.  I always do that when I'm loading the car to work at our "holiday let" otherwise I get there and realsie I didn't bring the door key !!!!! 

 

Wayne

As for bus wires for the lighting, you must first decide on what type of lighting you are going to use, we are using 3v LEDS, ( and going through loads, 20 in and around the new shed entrance and growing!! ) I am having to put two copper strips that act as bus wires under different buildings, and from them I can wire the bulbs, and also two wires back to another set of copper strips, which are acting as a sort of junction box, from them two single wires to the transformer.

I think that if I had put the bus wires/copper strip  under the base board at the same time as wiring the track, you can guess where the main buildings/ lights are going to be, this would make the job a lot easier now, as I would only be looking at dropping wires to solder to the bus/copper. You might have read that Pete is in the middle of building the set of platforms at the moment, and he has put two long lengths of copper running under each one, from which I will be able to link up the lighting on and around the station.

Although we all make list, you will still forget something, but I do agree with Perry, if you can make one, and maybe put it up here, I am sure someone will be able to add that something that you might have missed. I am just about to start a thread regarding our new HO layout, and we have decided to plan it all with help of everyone on here from the very start, following you really, as we are all learning even if we have done it all before.

[user=22]Wayne Williams[/user] wrote:

I've also been thinking of making a Perry —"To Do List" of the entire layout. Just so I don't forget something in the order that it should be done in. Has anyone ever seen a list like that?
Wayne

Wayne, my system is nowhere near comprehensive, but I've used a small notepad and headed various pages with projects that need doing. I used this to plan things I wanted to do in 2008.
I ended up with an Excel worksheet detailing the different things I needed to do for scenery on my upper level, electrics, backdrop etc.

The "work plan" was very handy when I did my Brewery Yard and was in fact one of "Perry's lists" computerised. The only problem I found in 2008 was that much of my planing did not actually get started because I have been doing a lot of work on the club layouts. (But I still have it on file for when I start the various projects).

When I started the "Belle View Steelworks" project, I used a post it note sheet to list the main areas "large building", "workshop" etc and then a seperate sheet for the details of each building. I never stick exactly to the order on these lists, but it does help me move on (I think)