Add an LED to Cab Ends for directional lighting??

Hi All               I have sent for a set of "Plastic Bits" for getting the bodywork off the chassis, Of a 4 CEP Class 411 EMU, Still waiting, but assuming the kit arrives and I get the bodywork off (in one piece) to fit the decoder. While the chassis is bare, and I'm testing the decoder, I would like to fit(remembering that I'm "Out of touch with modern technology) a directional red LED in the cabs behind the blinds, as for now both blinds show a white number. I did phone the Technical Staff at Bachmann, but I did not "Comprehend the Lingo", in actual fact I think the technician did't want to commit himself. Has anyone tried this or know if it is possible, as I don't like seeing a train with a white tail light , or for that matter, a red tail light in the middle of a train. Can someone please advise this poor soul.                                                     all the best  Kevin

To get the body off a 4-CEP you need 4 credit cards, store cards or similar.  Insert the first card in the centre and then slide to one end, then the second and slide to the other.  Do the same the other side taking care it doesn't come apart unexpectedly as they don't bounce very well! No special tools required!  On the 2-EPB there are also two screws under the cab.

Changing the way the lights work is not possible without major re-wiring.  Bear in mind one end has a route indicator number and you can't change that to red blinds at the flick of a switch (or change of direction).

The Kernow Thumper is the only unit of this type where they have got this sorted, but then by having white at one end and red at the other which reverse with train direction.  To do this you are no longer able to have a route number.

And when putting the body back on, make sure the LED at the front is properly positioned since if it is bent it can easily break off. Also check the windows are flush with the sides.



Edit - suggest this is moved from the baseboard forum to "Electrics - DCC"

Hi Robert               Thank  you, I had best leave well alone:oops:, and grit my teeth every time that I see a "White Tail Light" going by.                                                    all the best  Kevin

If you have the early green version - ie no yellow ends or yellow 1st class stripe - then white rear blinds are the correct mode of operation.  Red blinds were only brought into use much later - at about the time yellow ends were introduced. Up till then, traditional red oil tail lamps were the rule.

Hi Robert              Thank you for that info, the C E P set is "Plain Green, ends as well", that has saved me wasting my time for nothing.                                                            all the best  Kevin

if you are fitting a decoder then you can have directional lights,which means the panel going forward lights the other stays off,I don`t know the loco you are doing but on most it is also possible to fit ared l.e.d as a tail lamp yourself.
:thumbs;-):cool:

Hi Silver Fox             I do intend fitting decoders, or, paying someone to do the job, as I understand one has to be careful, not to snap off anything, or damage the bodywork. Speaking of Locos? I only have an 08 Bachmann Shunter, the others:sad: are on pre order from Kernow.At the moment I am trying out Bachmann. B R (S) Multiple units to run on my South London (ish) layout, one day , all being well, as soon as I have made all the "Viaducts" , I will be able to set the track, and embankments, to the correct height, I only hope that I can "stay the course". Robert has pointed out, the fact, that early green units only had a "Tail Lamp" at the rear, and the blinds were always white.                                                         all the best  Kevin

If whites at the rear bothers you remember that before the days of red roller blinds a tail lamp had to be carried.  You could fit one of those instead.

SR units equipped to display a headcode invariably showed white at the rear until the early 1960s.  Most units at that time had a white glass plate over which the stencil-plate was fitted at the front but which was left uncovered - never blanked over - at the rear.  

Signalmen were trained to observe the tail lamp and to acknowledge that and that alone confirmed the train had passed complete.

When the 1951 build of EPB units in the suburban area first introduced roller blinds instead of stencil plates they too showed white to the rear combined with a tail lamp.

From the early 1960s, as it became clear that all future stock planned and in build would have roller blinds, agreement was reached with all staff (particularly signalmen) that a double-red displayed at the rear of the train constituted the end-of-train marker.  In some cases a tail lamp was also carried usually in situations where the train was working somewhere not all staff were yet trained to accept the double-reds or (in the case of diesel units) that their battery might run down and the unit then show no rear light at all.

Berthed stock always had a tail lamp at each end in addition to anything the roller blinds showed unless one end was hard against the buffers.

To this day any roller-blind fitted SR stock working away from the region into areas where staff are not trained to accept double-reds must display a tail lamp as well.  Failure to do so will result in it being stopped for examination.  When SR stock (usually 4TC units) was diagrammed for haulage on routes such as Portsmouth - Cardiff and Waterloo - Exeter a tail lamp was required beyond Salisbury (in these cases) or other regional boundary.  The same was always true on delivery runs and when units of all types were towed off-region for work to be done.

Use of the blanks on SR roller blinds was very specific.  Double white was used at the leading end of any shunting movement or for any movement where no alpha-numeric code was provided; it was also the "default" setting and had to be used when units were coupled together at all points where the display was neither leading nor trailing - intermediate cabs in other words.  Double red meant only "This is the end of a complete train" and was not permitted to be used in any other context.  Black blanks were also provided and were for use only when a single-digit code was to be displayed.  "Double black" did not have a meaning though could sometimes be found on the inner end of a locomotive where double white would have been correct.

Unofficial appearances of blanks were sometimes seen and usually understood by local signalmen and other staff.  White plus red was used on some shunt moves which required reversal and very occasionally (and most definitely without authority) on short passenger routes such as Polegate - Hailsham and Littlehampton - Ford - Arundel - Littlehampton shuttles; this lazy practice was adopted as it meant the driver didn't have to reset the blinds at both ends every 2 - 3 minutes.  The potential for confusion to arise when a train shows both red and white (and usually at both ends during the move) is apparent - there is nothing to indicate which end will lead nor to confirm the train has passed complete.

Hi Rick                Thank you, all I remember was the question "How does the Signalman (now operator) know when a complete train has passed his cabin" answer "When he sees the Red Tail Light/Lamp". But that was a long time ago. For now with information from yourself and Robert I will be leaving well alone, and I think that Bachmann would have done their homework, I shall just have to live with three different eras of Rolling Stock, but they "strut their stuff well", and I'm not a rivet counter. But if I buy any more?? decide which era I am sticking to(as for the "Pre Ordered Stock, I'm not sure what I am waiting for???)              all the best  Kevin