Which wires to use .........

An old guy with a white beard left not one, but two Zimo sound decoders, speakers and stay-alives on our mantlepiece last week.  Many thanks indeed old chap but what am I to do with them ………………………?

The first "kit" is a Zimo MX648R decoder, an 8 ohm sugar cube speaker and a Lais 871007 stay-alive.  The decoder (in addition to the 8 wires attached to the 8 pin plug), has 2 purple wires and a brown wire.  The purple wires I think, are for the speaker (polarity is unimportant with a single speaker) but what is the brown wire for ? The Austrians say "Fu-Ausgang FA 2".  Where do I connect the 2 wires (+ and -) from the stay-alive ?

The second "kit" is a Zimo MX645R decoder, a LURVE 7 speaker and a Zimo MGOLANG Gold Cap stay-alive.  This decoder has the same 3 loose wires (2 purple and 1 brown) coming from the "wired" end of the decoder - again I'm guessing the 2 purple wires are for the speaker but what is the brown - "Funktions-Ausgang FA2" - a different function output but for what ?  The opposite end of this decoder has 2 additional wires attached - a blue and a grey.  These I presume, are for the stay-alive "Opt Speicher-Kondensator" - blue + and grey -.  Well done on that one Zimo …..

To summarise - what is that brown wire labelled "FA2" for and where, on the MX648R decoder, do I connect my stay-alive ?

Hi Peter,
If you go to the Zimo website all the wiring will be explained. However on both decoders you're right, the purple wires are for a speaker and the brown for FO2. The stay alive wires are for connecting a capacitor, but only a maximum of about *1000uf. If you want to connect a lais unit it should go to common pos and ground, which is where you'd connect on the 648 anyway. You must use a stay alive that has the control circuit such as the Lais to prevent inrush current causing the DCC system to trip on start up.

*I can't see the benefit of 1000uf so always use much higher. We all know that if you have perfectly laid and perfectly clean track you shouldn't need stay alive's, but we're fallible humans.

Thanks for your reply Pete.

I have no idea what the storage capacity of the Lais 871007 is but I think I saw a claim of between 1 and 6 seconds run time once fully charged - although that might have been on "N" Gauge….    That should do me - it's mainly for crossing a couple of dead frog slips which often seem to cause problems but I'm loathe to replace them because of the surgery required.  I tend to clean most of the track with one of those CMX track cleaning wagons which works very well.  Loco wheels are done with IPA on a cotton bud in a loco servicing cradle - when I can be bothered ……………….

I don't think I'd bother too much with stay-alives if I didn't have sound.  It's not an exhibition layout and the occasional tap with a finger wouldn't worry me too much.  However, having the sound project re-set whenever power is lost for more that a few milliseconds is very annoying !

Soldering the stay-alive to the MX 645 is no problem - the decoder is supplied with the necessary wires already attached.  The MX 648 on the other hand, is a different ball game.  There are no wires ready and, unless I got punch-drunk and didn't see it, the Zimo website doesn't say where to attach it (the stay-alive).

The other thing that's still foxing me is that brown wire …………..FA2  What IS FA2 supposed to do ?   I'm guessing a "Function" but why should it be separate and why decide to have  "Function 2" as a "special"  when it appears most of the other functions remain as blank solder pads ?  What would normally be connected to FA2 - is it for something specific and "often" but not always used ?  Do I ignore it or must it be connected to some necessary gadget ?

If you could point me in roughly the right direction, I'll have another study of the (complex) documentation on their website.

Many thanks.





 

You're right the Lais has a good storage capacity which can be adjusted time wise. But first things first. The stay alive wires on the 645 are only for small capacity cap's. It has inbuilt circuitry for a cap' no bigger than 1000uf. It seems that fitting a larger capacity could damage the decoder, so you connect the Lais which has it's own charging circuit, Blue to common positive and black to ground. The same applies to the 648 except that it doesn't have the extra wires and charging circuit.

With either of these decoders the time that a loco can run on with no track power can be adjusted. To do this you use CV153 to set the run time in tenths of a second. I always use 20 for 2 seconds. You can then adjust CV111 to cancel the CV4 momentum and bring the loco to a dead stop after it reaches the 2 seconds or whatever you've set. I always adjust CV4 to a high number such as 150 or even more and then I can use the brake key. Use CV309 to set which key to use and CV349 for braking effect. A good place to start is with 5. Hold the F key for emergency braking and dab it for a controlled stop.

The brown wire is just a function out put. You can use this for anything you want.

Hope this helps.

Now you're getting into the dark arts Pete - thus far, I've just used whatever settings were loaded in the decoder (except of course, the address).  I have on occasion, messed with CVs 2,3,4,5 & 6 but usually ended up with a loco running like a drunken pig so have gone back to default settings  !!

Maybe I should have a bit of a play around to see what does what although that would suggest I might have to read the Zimo Data Sheet - something I've managed to avoid doing for years !!

Still haven't grasped what the brown wire does - or rather, how it does it …………..could I have the fireman frying eggs on his shovel and if so, how would I tell the brown wire to do so ?

I know the Zimo manual isn't easy but if you click on CV summary list, it should help you understand some of the other stuff.

I do think it's time I started to read about these gizmos Pete - up to now, I've fitted the odd one, uploaded the sound project to a couple but otherwise, I've doine very little about understanding the "subject matter".  Whilst it's hardly a gripping novel, I'm going to have to do some reading now…………………………. 

I have to admit my eyes tend to glaze over, but sometimes it's a matter of reading and re-reading.
 

Reading the Zimo manual is mind-boggling to a non-techie like me but one does actually learn something.

Having said that, I really need to learn a new language - all those acronyms and references to electronic gadgets that I have absolutely no idea what they are !!

One starts reading and almost immediately, has to consult an electronics dictionary to find out what a microfarad is, never mind where one finds the symbol on a QWERTY keyboard !!  Then, all becomes clear - a microfarad is

I knew you'd be well on your way, Peter. Seriously though, why can't you use the stay alive? Is it a 3 wire one?

It's a Zimo MGOLANG device Pete - 50,000 uF storage but it states "Not for use with the older MX-Series of decoders, or decoders that do not have a regulated 16v output."

I haven't discovered yet if I can use it with a STACO 1 link or if it is completely unsuitable for the MX range.  Buying another type (Lais for example), isn't really a problem but I do try to bulk up orders to make more sense of the stupid postal charges.

Additionally, these "ready-made" stay-alives are much safer for me than having to solder up a few Tantalums - the last time I did that, I blew a decoder.  Fortunately, only an MX600 but it was still US after I'd connected the Tantalums to it.  Obviously shorted something out somewhere or got the Tantalums the wrong way round ………………….

You must have good eyes to be able to solder to the pads on decoders Peter, I only use plug-in decoders these days.


Ed

I think the safest thing would be to decide which layout of the Lais's suits you best and solder them to the common positive and ground pads. I've done a lot of these, but I have to wait for a day when my hands are pretty steady. Also good kit and plenty of light.

Ed, I use glasses and one of those magnifiers that you wear on your head. Works for me.

Yes, I too use those head magnifiers and a craft light - couldn't see a darned thing without either !!

For soldering to the pads (or indeed, for anything small) I use a fine pointed tip on a temperature controlled iron Ed although I too try desperately to avoid having to solder to the tiny pads.

I do try to use plug-in decoders wherever possible and the pads I'm talking about are at the other end of the decoder - for a stay-alive if Zimo haven't already provided wires.  Occasionally, when fitting sound, there just isn't room for everything and the socket has to go so it's a hard wire job.

I also follow published installation guides wherever possible - YouChoos have a comprehensive range of them although the odd video would be nice to see exactly how they package everything up "under the bonnet" ………

 

Am I right in thinking the Lais "packs" already have the necessary gear to control current flow thus avoiding overloading the controller Pete ?

I know the simple cylinder condenser doesn't have anything attached but the 871007 certainly has some kind of something attached.  Ideally I don't want to have to mess with the SACC gadgets or the YouChoos "Life Link"  Not sure what the SACC does (until I've read that far down the Zimo Instruction manual ……..)

Yes, the charging circuit is on the Lais so you can connect directly to the Common positive and ground. Blue wire is positive.

Hi Petermac and peterm,

I am so glad Wombat Creek is based in 1963. Well before the digital age!

Claus Ellef said

Hi Petermac and peterm,

I am so glad Wombat Creek is based in 1963. Well before the digital age!

From “Post #290,895”, 7th January 2025, 12:01 am

 

Claus Ellef said

Hi Petermac and peterm,

I am so glad Wombat Creek is based in 1963. Well before the digital age!

From “Post #290,895”, 7th January 2025, 12:01 am

Chicken !!!!

Petermac said

Claus Ellef said

Hi Petermac and peterm,

I am so glad Wombat Creek is based in 1963. Well before the digital age!

From “Post #290,895”, 7th January 2025, 11:01 am

Chicken !!!!

From “Post #290,907”, 7th January 2025, 11:23 pm