What is the best way to build them?

I am looking for ideas or solutions to a baseboard building problem I have. Be warned though, that I have only basic woodworking skills and have only ever built solid top baseboards on 2x1 frames.


Now that my old layout ( details here )  has finally gone to that great layout builder in the sky I am ready for a new venture. The new space I have available is fairly long (20ft) but thin (only 7ft wide). I plan to have a continuous run with a reasonable size fiddle yard to enable me to watch trains go by. There will be some sidings for shunting. Because of the nature of the space available I think there will be have to be some gradients involved and the fiddle yard will have to be under the main layout boards. The fiddle yard could well be solid topped but I would like the main board to be contoured so an open frame set up might be better for this.

Two questions really. Firstly is this a feasible set up and secondly how best could I achieve this two layered main area which will be approximately 20ft by 2ft/2ft 6? The gap between the two need not be too great as I suspect the fiddle yard would be more of a storage yard and all I would need would be space enough to reach in to the yard and lift out any derailments should they occur.

Any suggestions?

Thanks in anticipation of your help.

Unless I have missed something somewhere what happened to the loft layout you were designing?

This is the loft space I was talking about.  Originally the loft was split into two seperate rooms and initial negotiations led me to believe  I was getting both of them as layout space.  Unfortunately, I've now been told "you're only getting one and think yourself lucky".

Previous experience with my wife and daughter tells me that I'm outnumbered and this will indeed end up being the case, no matter what perfume/threats/cash inducements I may offer.  

Am I a man or a mouse?  Yep you guessed it - hence the rethink.

I too thought you were moving into the loft with an 18ft square to go at !!

I presume you're still in "OO" gauge ?  If so, the only concievable way you can have a continuous run in your quoted space, would be to use the full 7ft width at each end to turn through 180 degrees.  If you wanted the main part of the layout to be just down one side, then you could have a dog-bone shape but then you'd have some pretty sharp reverse curves - never a good idea.  My preference, with continuous run, would be to have the operating space in the middle. and one board of around 2ft down each side of the space.

With your 7ft width restriction, you're going to have enough room to operate and have some decent baseboards but you won't get a football team in there to help !!  Having a fiddle/storage yard at a lower level is a good idea - make that level solid topped and the main running level open topped.  Have a look in the "baseboards" section on the forum for some ideas about how to build your boards - there are several different methods covered and you don't need to be a cabinet maker !!! 

Sorry Bod - you posted as I was typing mine !!  Many of us have the same problem !!!  Masters of our own castles - you must be joking !!

Ah, join the club Bod.

In 4mm you are going to have some pretty tight curves in a 2 foot width. Have you considered having your 20' by 7' space divided so that you have a centre operating well of 2'6". That would give you two lengths of 20' by 2'3" with end boards. This gives you 7 feet at each end to swing curves plus more than 50 feet of run.

Another method when creating split-level layouts which can used to advantage is the set-up I have at one point on Penhayle Bay.  One line rises while the other falls to achieve vertical separation in half the horizontal space you would otherwise require.

In your case I am thinking that the main viewing / running line, which you say would be the upper level, will have junctions with the route to the yard falling away at the outer ends and where the main line curves around the returns.  

These are joined to a rising gradient off your storage yard board such that a train running continuously on the main line need only negotiate a slight dip (or climb over an up-and-over) but one entering storage will take the route off the main line and start to descend to the lower level as it negotiates a long sweeping curve.  It emerges from that at the lower level and can then be directed to the preferred siding on the level.

That should be quite easy with your suggested hard top lower level and open upper level.  I see no problem with that arrangement as you simply construct a gentle gradient on the top of the lower boards and drop the yard tracks through the structure of the upper ones and ultimately through a cut-out to join with the lower level.  

The same set up can be employed at both ends but using different scenery.  You could for example build one end with the yard route dropping out of sight into a cutting behind the main lines and the other with it running in front then dropping into a tunnel or the main lines coming up and over on a suitably impressive bridge or viaduct.

That is what I had in mind at one stage to maximise my own on-track storage but it became apparent that the width of my main board (90 cms) would make access to the rear-most lower level tracks impossible.  I also learned quickly that it is not practicable to store rolling stock outside for any length of time anyway so the whole idea was abandoned and I live with a long fiddle yard at one level but with rather fewer tracks than I would wish.

Just a quick reply - thanks for the input so far.

I don't think I masde myself clear.  The 20 ft by 2ft will not be the total layout - just one side as you suggest.  I intend to have the main line running along this and then round the other walls but an unfortunately placed door in the partition wall means that the fiddle yard, if placed on that 'back' wall would not be very long, hence the idea of using long gradients on that wall to bring the double tracks back round and underneath the main board.  I will try and sketch something out later.

My initial thought was for the legs to be laddered or like a letter H  so that the fiddle yard could rest on one 'rung' and the uppor board on the top. I'm still not sure how I could fit an open top type board on the top.  Hence the plea for help.

Gwiwer (is it Rick?) I was thinking something aong those lines - but it's the actual mechanics of producing it that has me stumped at the moment. Oh that I had Gordon19's woodworking skills.

Rick it is.

If you're stumped on the mechanics of woodworking then I might be tempted to build both levels as you already know how, namely flat-top and braced underneath.

You can then learn open-top board-building for another time and at your own pace rather than feeling pressured to get it learned, right and looking good on a fair-sized project first go.

How to make the gradients?

There are lots of possibilities.

I have the necessity of having baseboards at varying heights due to the outside location.  This gave me an opportunity to place some at slight angles to achieve a gradient.

There are products off the shelf to help build upwards or you simply cut some sort of solid substrate such as a block of balsa to suit.

To go downhill you need to plan a bit in advance.  You can either have your line raised on an embankment and drop to board level or you can cut a piece out of the board itself to create a cutting and tunnel.  It might be easiest to do that at the edge of the board rather than cutting a hole in the middle if you don't fancy anything more than elementary woodwork.

It isn't hard to build 2x1 bracing around a cut hole but you should have a brace at every edge of board; leave nothing to chance.

There is a basic board-building tutorial at the start of my surf beach thread here which might help.

Or just bung a helix on the end like on my Penzance layout and then return the lines straight back under the main board.

Good luck, BoD.
I think your woodwork is better than you pretend.

I think using an H frame will work well BoD.  I would use 50 x 50 for the legs and have the rear one taller than the front which will give you something to attach a backscene to if you intend fitting one.  50 x 50 is also strong enough to hold a lighting gantry should you choose to add one.  The solid baseboard for the lower section will brace the whole thing and frames on 600mm centres should be fine. May be idea to add adjustable feet also and these can be fitted into the square section legs.

Clearance on the lower section should be carefully considered.  6" may be sufficient if the tracks are right at the front and do not extend back too deeply.  The difficulty as always will be trying to rerail coaches or bogie wagons when they are behind other trains.  Think carefully about the location of pointwork as they will fail.  Switch blades may come loose or tie bars come adrift, so access to those is critical.

The open plan upper sections are quite easy to produce.  I know you have Templot and this will supply templates for the track bed with whatever clearance you require.  There are some details of this method in my own layout thread.  These open plan sections will require bracing across the 600mm spacings so use 50 x 25 under the ply trackbed or 30/40mm lengths of 4mm mdf.  These have the advantage of being flexible enough to go round corners.  Again one length each side will give you a strong light girder that will stay flat.

If you are going to use Tortoise motors, they will require about 4" clearance so allow for that in your gradient calculations or again consider the positions of turnouts carefully so they do not foul the lower levels.

Great to hear things are moving on.  Just a shame you don't live closer as I would be happy to help out and cut the timber accurately to length for you.

Seems your Wembley scarf will have to be put away for another year….;-)

My weekend just got better after Spurs gave away that penalty…