GWR/LMS OO Gauge DCC RR&Co

[user=1560]emmess[/user] wrote:

I'll definitely be building it, John, thank you for the offer. I have already followed your build and seen your learnings as you went, but any advice would be more than welcome. Mine will be smaller (N Gauge) and not as long, as I'm modelling just the very front part of the station. The roof will therefore be hiding the fiddle-yard entry point.

Thats a great idea using it to mask the entrance to a fiddle yard……..wish I had done that now!

It probably takes care of a cople of issues I have………namely visibility and access.

As supplied you can look down through the roof to admire the scenery and more importantly check the loco stopped where you intended. I eliminated some of the upper panels to counteract this.

Its a very ingenious design but the arches do need to be anchored firmly…….the structure benefits if the arches are under slight compression. However you will need to be able to remove the roof to access the track from time to time. If I were doing it again I would fit pegs or dowels into the base of the arches and slot the pegs into brass tubing set into the baseboard rather than use the adjacent buildings as support…….it would be less less cumbersome to move and more rigid.

The arches are connected at the peak by a ridge of quite thin card……..I substituted plastic beams which are much more stable.

One final point…….dont be tempted to economise on the card you use for the arch laminations. Use precisely the thicknesses specified by John Wiffen otherwise you will have an unexpected and unsatisfactory result :roll: You can guess how I know this! The arches take a long time to cut out and it was pretty frustrating to have to scrap my first two!

Hope this helps

Good luck with the build

John

Thanks John - all very useful. Once I am ready to make a start, I think I will be needing your help as I progress! If mine turns out half as atmospheric and 'well planted' in the town as yours, then I will be a very happy man!

On a September evening in North Wales 2259 waits for the signal to the goods relief loop at Cynwyd. . Perhaps not your typical GWR branch scene. Nevertheless I hope you can sense the heat radiating from those grimy walls and terraces



This is the first of my goods trains that will operate on the lower level. Spent most of last week fettling and fixing as I ran it round and round the new circuit. The train is a mixture of old and new but a common feature was the necessity to get NEM coupling pockets fitted at a standard height. The bulky tension lock couplings were chopped out of the old stock and Dapols droopy pockets replaced on the new.





Here are some snapshots as the train eases past the coal siding and on to the loop



The plan is to drop off and pick up the two leading wagons in Cynwyd  yard. This pair of Suncole coke wagons are 20 year old veterans of  Granby I  






The rear wagons including this Ale wagon will be exchanged at Danby brewery




Rather conveniently for me GRANO was the GWR telegraph code for bulk Grain carriers.

Any idea how the grain would be discharged at the brewery…..top or bottom? Suggestions much appreciated



The Brake Van bringing up the rear is Hornby's new version of the iconic GWR toad. It presents a sharp contrast to some of my older stock with its fine detail…..including separate hand rails, glazed windows and a detailed verandah

This van has been weathered, lamped and branded although I have to confess the side lamp is only on one side. :oops: They are quite fragile and the train room floor must be littered with them.

Similarly Granby is only on one side. You can guess where the G came from but there are only a limited number of Granos and Banburys on a transfer sheet. :roll:




The Guard is an addition …..not part of the verandah detailing. He is one of the Moduloc range of 3D figures. They are made by scanning real life figures. Its a very interesting range of train crew and station staff in (obviously) life like poses. Usual disclaimer….just a very satisfied customer.


Shunting completed the train leaves Cynwyd for its last drop off at Danby Brewery






Back to reality……here is the train entering the still uncovered storage siding. The newly laid track is now ballasted but Danby Brewery is represented by the demolition site on the right!





Regards from Vancouver where we continue to enjoy/suffer 30o + days. The  cooling off-shore breezes have ceased so the smoke from the forest  fires has returned……not at all pleasant but it must be so much worse  for the poor folk in the interior

John

Not sure if this is correct for a GWR served brewery in your time period John, but he talks about grain being unloaded into a pit below the wagon.

http://www.igg.org.uk/rail/7-fops/fo-grain.htm



Ed

Looking good - I love that black and white pic with the guard in his van. You have a great eye for atmospheric detail.

[user=1338]Ed[/user] wrote:

Not sure if this is correct for a GWR served brewery in your time period John, but he talks about grain being unloaded into a pit below the wagon.

http://www.igg.org.uk/rail/7-fops/fo-grain.htm



Ed

Thanks Ed…..I should have thought of checking there….that site is a great resource. It's while before I do it but a hatch between the rails seems the way to go
Cheers

John

[user=1560]emmess[/user] wrote:

Looking good - I love that black and white pic with the guard in his van. You have a great eye for atmospheric detail.

Thanks Mike…..glad you like it:thumbs

Cheers

John

Lovely to see the Baby Castle being put to good use John.
I have a couple of Granos in my fleet… and no Brewery (yet)… goodness knows what they could be used for in N Emlyn.


Cheers

Marty

Thanks Marty
I remember you have always had a soft spot for Collett Goods……I still have my original split chassis……it growls its way round the layout hauling some very long trains…..sadly doesn't like the set track curves at the lower level

The Collet shown is a later model with an ROD tender……silky smooth runner but struggled to pull the skin off a rice pudding until I put lead in every conceivable position:roll:

Could you use your Grano to haul grain to a cattle feed plant…….there must have been one in the area? Mind you there must be a brewery near by

Cheers 

John

The second of the four new trains for the branch will consist of Private Owners coal wagons . Picking up at the colliery and exchanging for empties at Cynwyd coal sidings and local industries like the Creamery and Brewery.

There is some modellers licence employed here…….I suspect it was more usual for coal wagons to be part of the daily pick up goods but with Granby being in the heart of the North Wales Coal fields, its not completely unrealistic.

All Private Owners wagons were absorbed into a national pool for the duration of WWII. After nationalisation British Railways took over the wagons and paid their owners compensation. I do wonder if they would have been returned to private ownership during the period 1945-8? Nevertheless I rather like the idea of delivering coal to Danby Brewery in a Danby wagon :roll:   

The train will have six wagons with six similar wagons at the various locations. The wagons are an assortment of RTR and kit built. Some date back to Granby I (1991), others are brand new.

I set up a production line to paint out some of the insides, insert some residual coal scraps for the empties and attempt to sort of standardise so many different ages of weathering.



Not the difference in side thickness between the Oxford "Barton &Co" and the Bachmann "Lunt"

Ignore the tracksetta……..multi tasking again. Not much space left on Granby so the flattened  brewery site was a great work bench

You can conceal the loaded state of most freight but not open coal wagons. It really does look daft delivering an empty coal wagon to the brewery and exchanging it for an empty. I get around this with the long colliery train by having separate dedicated loaded and empty trains. This wont work for the local train so I am experimenting with transferable loads 







Not sure whether it will be more efficient to swap loads or wagons between operating sessions……in the dead of night.

Regardless the sponge does seem to make a much better base for the coal than the card shims I used previously.

Here are some shots of the train approaching Cynwyd……..hope you like POWs :lol:




Hauled by a pannier…..of course.








As far as I know we have no family connection with the coal trade…….but my surname is conveniently short!



These are my new acquisitions from Oxford……..they have come in for a lot of criticism for some of their offerings but to my untutored eyes these wagons represent excellent value with a far better level of detail than their competitors.

These both started life as number 321……sometimes its easier to do some judicious weathering rather than fiddle with new numbers

After looking at these shots I decided the coal was bit overscale for domestic use so out came the hammer. I also trimmed 1/4" off the sponge base



Bachmann Lunt for the creamery and Slaters kit for the brewery.





Bringing up the rear a 12 ton Brake. I was quite proud of this white metal when I built it in 2004…..sadly I later learned that they would only have been in Departmental use in 1948 :twisted:. So its languished in the display case for the last decade. However needs must……. the advent of four new freight trains converted my surplus of RTR Toads into a shortage. I may brand it "Only for use between Corwen and Mold" or similar

The train now approaches Cynwyd




Merchants empties in the coal siding. Empty from the Creamery in the yard.  Suncole coke wouldnt come from the colliery so it will be part of the daily pick up run 


In a flash the shunting is completed  :roll:




and the train heads off to its last drop at the brewery




The ultra observant may wonder how and why the red Thrutchley wagon first seen coupled to the pannier is now bringing up the rear! Hand of god and change of plan…..brewery coal supply doubled





It would be better if Ben Morgan adjusted the sidelamp instead of waving at Bronwen and Gladys.

Regards from Vancouver where it is about to become wet and windy

Looking great. Nice and dirty!

Great photos John and an interesting topic too - loaded wagons for empties ………… :thumbs

At first, I thought the hammer was to help squeeze the foam into the empties ……… :roll: :lol: :lol: :lol:   Do you use the flexibility of the foam when lifting the loads out ?  If so, how do you make sure the coal doesn't come adrift ?

I presume you hide whatever you use as weight (if indeed, you do use weight) inside the foam ………… :roll: :roll:   On the few I've "messed" with, I use an M8 nut or two hidden in the load for weight and remove the load with a magnet.  My empties are pristine but the foam is a great idea - would allow some residues as you've done to great effect.  Are your empties weighted at all ?

Just a slight point - I think they may be a bit over loaded.  :roll:  I'm not sure the load would be so proud of the wagon sides unless it was netted or sheeted - too much risk of shedding some coal.  I may be wrong but I'd imagine  the load was kept within the wagon body - but then it wouldn't look half as good ……….. :thumbs

I love watching these "spaces" develop on Granby - keep them coming.  :cheers

Aye, thoroughly enjoying the pictorial story and the ride here too.
The weathering looks fine to me but I agree with Petermac that the load sits a bit high. There is a weight limit too which might be exceeded with so much aboard.

Nice idea of the magnet Peter.

Cheers

Marty

[user=1560]emmess[/user] wrote:

Looking great. Nice and dirty!

Thanks Mike

"Nice and dirty" our speciality! :lol:

Thanks Peter :thumbs

[user=6]Petermac[/user] wrote:

Great photos John and an interesting topic too - loaded wagons for empties ………… :thumbs

At first, I thought the hammer was to help squeeze the foam into the empties ……… :roll: :lol: :lol: :lol:   Do you use the flexibility of the foam when lifting the loads out ?  If so, how do you make sure the coal doesn't come adrift ?

  A very small screwdriver just prises one end up. The flexibility of the foam below the load makes this easier than my old method with card. The top of the foam has a thick layer of neat PVA and the coal is scattered on top….pressed in …..and then I spray it with diluted PVA that I use for ballast. I leave it overnight and then turn it upside down and give it a shake!

Having said that some still comes off in service…..fortunately Doreen gave up on the train room carpet a long time ago.

Having gone to all the trouble of making moveable loads I am not sure if it isnt quicker to swap the wagons……as long as I dont deliver coal empties to your creamery I will be a happy camper! :lol:

 I presume you hide whatever you use as weight (if indeed, you do use weight) inside the foam ………… :roll: :roll:   On the few I've "messed" with, I use an M8 nut or two hidden in the load for weight and remove the load with a magnet.  My empties are pristine but the foam is a great idea - would allow some residues as you've done to great effect.  Are your empties weighted at all ?

The foam isnt weighted…….I use lead flashing cut to size and glued to the underside of most of the wagons. They are supposed to all weigh in the same…..many years ago I had an old postal scale but I dont bother now….I just use Cynwyd Bank, the gradient between the two levels, as a test

Just a slight point - I think they may be a bit over loaded.  :roll:  I'm not sure the load would be so proud of the wagon sides unless it was netted or sheeted - too much risk of shedding some coal.  I may be wrong but I'd imagine  the load was kept within the wagon body - but then it wouldn't look half as good ……….. :thumbs

You are absolutely right……when I saw the photos I realised the load was too high and the coal too big…..so, as I said, out came the hammer and a craft knife to trim the foam down…….I am afraid I was too idle to re shoot :oops:

I have seen lots of photos were the load could b seen above the wagon body…….but never anything quite as ambitious as mine :oops: :oops: 

I love watching these "spaces" develop on Granby - keep them coming.  :cheers

Thanks again Peter…..glad you enjoyed it

Best Wishes

John

[user=19]Marty[/user] wrote:

Aye, thoroughly enjoying the pictorial story and the ride here too.
The weathering looks fine to me but I agree with Petermac that the load sits a bit high. There is a weight limit too which might be exceeded with so much aboard.

Nice idea of the magnet Peter.

Cheers

Marty

Thanks Marty…….our posts crossed…..as you can see in my reply to Peter, I agree the loads on some of the wagons are far too high……steps have been taken…..the Colliery weigh bridge foreman has been fired and more importantly 1/4" has been  shaved off the foam :roll:

Best wishes

John

Hi John,

I've been out of things lately due to the loss of my mum, but willfully getting back into the swing of things again. A return to sunny France and our guests helps and of course diversions like our forum and yes, what a dirty boy you have been. I love it!

It's all been said by others of course, as you have done a splendid job on those wagons and thank goodness you have, as pristine coal wagons look just silly, except when new and parked outside the wagon works. Now there's a theme!

Anyway, I've enjoyed as always, your latest Granby tales, together with the enthusiasm for ever developing Granby, which obviously gives you such joy.

Many thanks John and never stop. It gives so much pleasure and inspiration to others.

Best,

Bill 

PS. That Hornby Toad is the best so far. I just hope Oxford get theirs right as well.

Hi Bill
Thanks for that post……I am so glad you enjoy my ramblings.

I am sorry to hear about your Mum……..family bereavements are invariably traumatic……regardless of whether they are expected or unexpected, it takes a long time for life to settle back to its routine…..you have my sympathies…..we went through something similar last year.

Not sure what to expect with the Oxford Brake Van. The experts are not enthusiastic, mind you they rarely are. Apparently the Four wheel version uses parts from the six wheel version and the cutouts for the centre wheel are still in place! There was also some mix up with metal cladding on the ends……I guess it's wait and see.

I am still eagerly awaiting the Dean Goods ……..the first release was not well received by the experts but I read nothing but positive reviews about its running performance from those who've bought one.

Thanks again for such a positive post

Best wishes 

John

Great post John, loaded wagons going in and out of a coal yard has always been a bug bear of mine so having removeable loads is excellent, if I can offer a suggestion, the foam infills, cut an angle at the ends so that when lifted there isn't as much chance of the ends catching and lifting the wagon, also the suggestion of a lump of metal in the load so it can be lifted with a magnet is a good one, I use a drawing pin with a bit of coal dust glued to it then painted satin black.

Cheer's, Pete.   

Thaky you John for your kind understanding,

The experts in that other place sometimes cause a degree of frustration, which at least is usually entertaining. However, on the subject of the Dean Goods, I am rather hoping that their critisismn is bringing must needed improvements and if so, is a great result for the RM movement as a whole and congratulations also to Oxford, for listening and acting to constructive input. This certainly seems to be working with the NRM's Dean Goods, although it is still way too shiney, although I appreciate why.

I also hope that the footboards on their four wheeled Toad have cut outs simply to facilitate the sample mock up, which shoud have correct examples for the production versions.

Hot and sunny here, so off to clean the pool and enjoy the great outdoors.

Best,

Bill