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South Shore Line ..... Outhouse - Scratchbuilding. - More Practical Help - Your Model Railway Club
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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 07:09 pm
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Wayne Williams
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Here is a door open picture of, yea you guessed it, my outhouse :oops: :oops: :oops:

I have purchased all the necessary items to model it (I hope). I have even made a drawing of it that is four times the HO scale. Really had to because it is so small.

Now I need the help of you guys. Has anyone ever actually hinged a door in this scale?
If I don't hinge it, I would still like to have it opened up some anyway, then how would I attach it?
Please keep in mind that this thing is very [size=SMALL. Whose idea was this anyway?]

Sorry, lost control there for a minute. Really it is only about 3/4" x 1" x 1 1/2" high. I don't even want to think what I'm going to do for a door knob :roll: :roll:

Wayne




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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 07:22 pm
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The hinged door is quite easy Wayne as all you have to do is glue a piece of paper on the back of the door down it's long side that overlaps the inside wall of the building and there you have it. As for the door knob, use a pin. The door would have to be fitted either before the roof or the floor is in position as you wont be able to get at it once the 'box' is enclosed top and bottom. That's one of the reasons you need a 'to do'list.



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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 07:26 pm
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Wayne Williams
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Thanks Bob!

I guess I'm thinking too .... durable :oops:

Wayne :D



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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 07:28 pm
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Robert
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A paper hinge, say decent printing or writing paper, will last for hundreds of openings and closings. I have added to the above post by the way.



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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 09:24 pm
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Wayne Williams
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Fear Not! I have a "To Do List", but I think I will call it a "To Do Before List" 8) 8) 8)

I even thought about hinging or having a removable floor, so I could get back inside if I ever needed too. Haven't given up on that one yet.

Wayne



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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 09:29 pm
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Perry
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How about hinged seats? :roll: :lol: :lol: :lol:

Only kidding, Wayne. Bob has pretty much answered everything for you here, but I will make one small suggestion if I may.

That lovely wood grain inside really deserves replicating if you are going to have the door open, but the internal painting will need to go on the 'To Do Before You Glue The Walls Together' list. :roll: :lol:

Perry



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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 09:31 pm
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Wayne Williams
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Thanks Perry, but I may need your help on the "Inside"

Wayne :D



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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 09:34 pm
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To easily replicate that what looks like a wooden back wall you could use a couple of strips cut off that stuff you buy for finishing off the edges of chipboard furniture. Can't think of the name now but it comes in all types of wood finish. Find a lot of uses for it round the layout.



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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 09:57 pm
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Perry
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It is or was called Contiboard here in the UK, I believe, but is basically a plastic veneered chipboard. The edging strip mentioned can be applied to any cut edges by heating it with a domestic electric iron. I'm sure you could buy a metre of something very similar for a few pence at your local DIY emporium. :wink:

Perry



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 Posted: Thu Dec 13th, 2007 10:16 pm
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Wayne Williams
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You guys really have me thinking now. What if I would crop the picture of the outhouse, down to just the area of the wood, then reduce the picture down in size to almost match HO scale, then add three or four copies together in my photo software enough to fit the back wall of the outhouse, and print it out on my computer, and glue it on the back wall. 8) 8) 8)

Am I getting in the groove now? :P

Wayne



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 Posted: Fri Dec 14th, 2007 01:30 am
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darrenscots
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Hi Wayne, i assume that you will do a mock-up first...



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 Posted: Fri Dec 14th, 2007 06:46 am
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Perry
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Wayne Williams wrote:You guys really have me thinking now. What if I would crop the picture of the outhouse, down to just the area of the wood, then reduce the picture down in size to almost match HO scale, then add three or four copies together in my photo software enough to fit the back wall of the outhouse, and print it out on my computer, and glue it on the back wall. 8) 8) 8)

Am I getting in the groove now? :P

Wayne


Sounds like a nice bit of 'lateral thinking' to me. :wink: Our Bob is a Master at coming up with ideas like that, whereas I don't have any imagination whatsoever. :( May be you could print out more copies than you will need for the actual model, then use some of them on a card mock up - just to see if you like the overall effect.

Just a thought: there are some sites on the internet where you can download free 'texture' files; images of various kinds of materials such as stone, wood, brick, etc., etc. On our old forum (pre-Big Bang :cry: ) I think there was a link to one or two of them. I'm not sure if it has been brought across to this forum though. I don't have time to check right now as I have a train to catch this morning but it might be worth checking out our index.

And yes - I think you are getting in the groove now! :wink: :D :D

Perry



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 Posted: Fri Dec 14th, 2007 11:12 am
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Wayne Williams
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In regards to a mockup first, well actually I was not. This thing is so small and really not much detail to it. If I did screw it up, not much would be lost.

Famous Last Words :?

Wayne



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 Posted: Fri Dec 14th, 2007 12:17 pm
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Robert
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The Texture file that Perry is referring to is in the Lineside section and here is a taster from that selection. Worth a look Wayne.

http://www.mayang.com/textures/Wood/html/Flat%20Wood%20Textures/index.html
Redundant link.     Barchester



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 Posted: Wed Dec 26th, 2007 07:43 pm
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Wayne Williams
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[size=Respect, Lots of RESPECT!!]

After cutting out these pieces that's all I have for Perry and Novice (and anyone else out there who does scratchbuilding)

OK, actually it wasn't that bad (still have that RESPECT though), but I did notice a few things. The white pieces are made by Everygreen Scale Models and the thickness was .030. It took many passes (15) with the x-acto knife to cut through it. I even had trouble keeping the cut edge straight, I tended to cut it on an angle thru the materials thickness.
The grey (Roof) material is by Plastruct and is a vacuum formed sheet. It's thickness was .015 and it cut a whale of a lot easier, but it will be much more difficult keeping it "Flat" once installed. :cry: :cry:

I believe I have made a BIG mistake in choosing the materials for this project. The clapboard siding appears to be too small (in scale). As I count the layered boards on the prototype photo there are 14 showing. When I counted them on my model there are 19 showing. So, even though the package said "HO Scale" it didn't match. The asphalt shingles are a little closer, they only have two additional rows.

After cutting all these pieces out, I tried comparing them to each other. No, I didn't take a photo of them, too embarrassed. :oops: :oops: :oops: So I decided to go out in the garage and hunt up a sheet of 150 grit sandpaper. I then place the two like parts together, ie: the two end walls, and very lightly scraped them across the sandpaper, which was laying on the table, to match them up. That seemed to work very well. The stuff I was sanding off was mostly the angle that I had cut into the piece, luckily every one I had to sand off was over the actual cut size needed. Maybe it's because I am left handed. :? :? or just lucky. :shock: :shock: :shock:

Did I say this thing is Small, well it is! How in the world am I going to glue these pieces together and keep them square, straight, and plum? My thumb will just barely fit inside this without the roof on. Before anyone says anything, Yes, I'm all thumbs, :o :o that's why I referenced it.

All in all, I pleased, it's nice to be finally doing something. So, next after everyone answers the previous paragraph, I will need to layout the corner trim pieces, soffits, and the facing of the entrance door. Of course I can't forget the "Two Holes"!!!

Wayne






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 Posted: Wed Dec 26th, 2007 09:27 pm
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Perry
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You shouldn't need more than a couple of light passes with a knife to cut .030" plastikard, because all you do is score it, then snap it off. Very quick and very easy. :wink: :D

To keep the corners square you could use small triangular pieces of scrap plastikard as braces or fillets with one of the corners cut to 90 degrees, or you could cut an internal 'floor' piece and assemble the walls around that.

Glueing them around a floor will also help you to align them vertically.

You could even make it a double floor, one piece being a base to rest the walls on, and the second forming the floor 'inside' the walls. So you would have a floor sandwich, so to speak, giving you a ledge all around the outside onto which you glue your walls.

With regard to the clapboard siding not being to scale, if you want absolute accuracy, count the boards, divide the width (in millimetres) that you need to span by that number, then just scribe the boards into plain plastikard. It's what I did with the sliding doors on the goods shed because I wanted to copy the way the doors were framed and clad as accurately as possible. I like a challenge! :roll: :lol:

Believe me, it does get a whole lot easier with practice. :D Keep going and you will be surprised how quickly you pick it up.

Perry



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 Posted: Thu Dec 27th, 2007 12:39 am
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Wayne Williams
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Thanks Perry,
I was leery of snapping it until I had cut almost all the way through. I will try it next time though. You still must cut one side completely though before you can snap a cut 90 degrees to that cut. Unless you've got a shortcut for that too. :shock: :shock:

I like your double floor idea. In fact with a little alteration from it I can solve another problem I was having. If you look at the prototype picture at the top of this thread you will see a fairly heavy chunk of lumber around the bottom of the outhouse. I think the double floor idea will work to make that also.

With a project this small, is it still a good idea to double up on the wall thickness for strength?

When it comes time to start glueing things together, does anyone have tricks up their sleeve on how to apply the glue? I have Plastruct Bondene (Styrene & ABS Cement) with a brush attached to the cap. The brush looks very large to me. The bristles have spread out to about 1/4" in diameter (6 mm) at the tip.

Wayne



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 Posted: Thu Dec 27th, 2007 01:34 am
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Paul Williams
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Hi Wayne With all this planning and discussion can you imagine what it will take to do the farm house.
Your parts look great. I would try using a toothpick to put the glue on. A drop of glue on wax paper then the tip or just below the tip is where the glue would go.

DAD (Paul W.)

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 Posted: Thu Dec 27th, 2007 06:16 am
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Perry
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Wayne Williams wrote:Thanks Perry,
I was leery of snapping it until I had cut almost all the way through. I will try it next time though. You still must cut one side completely though before you can snap a cut 90 degrees to that cut. Unless you've got a shortcut for that too. :shock: :shock:

I like your double floor idea. In fact with a little alteration from it I can solve another problem I was having. If you look at the prototype picture at the top of this thread you will see a fairly heavy chunk of lumber around the bottom of the outhouse. I think the double floor idea will work to make that also.

With a project this small, is it still a good idea to double up on the wall thickness for strength?

When it comes time to start glueing things together, does anyone have tricks up their sleeve on how to apply the glue? I have Plastruct Bondene (Styrene & ABS Cement) with a brush attached to the cap. The brush looks very large to me. The bristles have spread out to about 1/4" in diameter (6 mm) at the tip.

Wayne


You will certainly get a cleaner separation if you only snap off along one cut at a time. With practice you can get fairly complex shapes out in one piece though.

You could double up the wall thickness but if you are using .030" I would have thought this would have been quite strong enough for the size of the building.

For applying solvent you need a brush that comes to a good point as you only need to apply small amounts. I use a Size 2 for general work and a Size 0 for finer work.

Don't use tube glue but only liquid solvent for this job.

Perry



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 Posted: Sat Dec 29th, 2007 09:42 pm
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Wayne Williams
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I have managed to get a little more done on my Outhouse. After a phone call to the grandkids up north I now realize that this two hole outhouse is actually a three holer. So much for my research. :oops: :oops:

I have assembled the two sides and the back wall with the sub floor. The sub floor won't be seen once the model is finished. I have cut in two of the three seat holes, the third one won't be seen so I elected not to cut it out. The three sided assembly in front of the seat is the seat riser.

The entrance door is shown to the left with it's cladding. The cladding is cut from a sheet of plain styrene .012 thick. Had to take my time cutting that out as it's only a quarter inch wide. I am concerned about trying to glue it to the entrance door because it is so thin. Don't want to melt it with the glue.:cry: :cry: :cry: I wonder would it help to let the glue dry for several seconds before placing the cladding on to reduce the melting?

I have been thinking about glueing the door in an open position instead of hinging it. Is it really worth hinging it?

I think it was Bob (FC) who recommended using a pin head for a door handle. I held one up to it and it looks too big to me. Now what? Any other ideas out there?

Wayne



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