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00 Gauge - Maxmill Junction - Members Personal Layouts. - Model Railway Layouts. - Your Model Railway Club
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 Posted: Wed May 20th, 2020 11:24 pm
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BCDR
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Hi Peter,

Head and foot are too wide. 

If you go the jig route be aware that as far as I know there is not one that matches Peco. You would need to go with a wider angle jig and then close-up when soldering. Or make your own jig from wood. The EMGS have an adjustable jig. If you have a grinding wheel you can do your own. Until  I got the jigs I used the Dremel and a large wheel clamped to the bench. If you go with a conventional angle/frog then you would be looking at relaying the track as well, given the exits are going to be different. Or you could just go Atlas, who I think do a #5. Frogs are North American though.

For a price C+L did/do soldered up frogs and filed blades. Check DCCconcepts as well. Marcway do small, medium and large radius RTR points that I believe match Peco. Sleeper length is I think different. Copper clad so can be trimmed. Will need shimming as well.

Nigel



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 Posted: Thu May 21st, 2020 05:28 am
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Briperran
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Peter re the springs in the points

Peco will send you them free of charge all you need is to send a stamped addressed envelope to them and they will send you them.

Obviously Peco realised long ago the springs were a weak point in the product to supply replacements free of charge.

The springs get lost and rust and break easily so they will send you them just say you have more than you need in the letter you send them. You can ring them and ask the receptionist will give you the details.


Brian



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 Posted: Thu May 21st, 2020 07:16 am
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Petermac
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Nigel - it's becoming clear that modifying my Peco points is a non-starter so I'm left with a choice between waiting for electrofrogs to re-appear on the market or keep my insulfrogs and fit SAs.

I think maybe a combination of both will be my selected route.  IMHO, SAs are always a useful addition, particularly with sound chips.

Brian, the problem isn't a lack of springs - I have some of those, retained when I removed them for Tortoise operation - it's the ability to fit them !!  I did eventually discover where they fitted and which way up but I just can't do it myself.  These are the newer design of point with the little plate covering the spring housing and held in place by the metal "prongs" from the "U" shaped metal clip type thing.  Not very well described but if you have both older and newer designs, you'll know what I mean ...........................

I do have a single Tortoise motor left over so could use that on 1 point but the 2nd one will have to wait for now - I'll re-fit the insulfrog in that position.  In respect of Tortoise motors, I see they're now over £20 each - when available - so they are quite an expensive item ..............




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 Posted: Thu May 21st, 2020 08:29 am
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Whilst mulling over the situation of my lack of points, missing springs and shortage of Tortoise motors, I suddenly remembered I do have a stock of servo motors which I used with the Megapoints system.

I could make this first LS150 decoder into a multi facet decoder - some SEEP motors, a single Tortoise and maybe, a couple of Servos............................ :hmm

It would certainly make programming it interesting ............... :shock:



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 Posted: Thu May 21st, 2020 12:49 pm
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BCDR
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Hi Peter,

You have identified the big issue with Peco code 100 - once you start you are stuck, especially with an existing layout. Changing an insulfrog to an electrofrog looks daunting, it is not. What you are keeping is the geometry. John (Brossard) used to build replacements for insulfrogs just using the Peco turnout plan. 

One thing that should always be checked with old insulfrogs is wear on the frog. If it is significantly lower than the closure and frog rails then a short rigid wheelbase will rock. A straight edge with a light behind will show whether this has happened. 

Peters spares.com has some in stock. No vat. Modeltrainstuff.com over here has large radius electrofrogs on special at $20.00 and in stock. You could also try Yankee Dabbler. There are plenty of new ones on eBay UK as well.

Nigel




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 Posted: Thu May 21st, 2020 01:09 pm
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Petermac
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Peters Spares appear to have only 9 points in stock Nigel - none of which I want plus, here in France, we do pay VAT.  Shipping from the States to France is almost a no-no.  The French authorities demand their pound of flesh and, the one time I did buy (servos) from the US, the cost doubled when import duty was added.

John (Brossard) is in a different league to myself when it comes to modelling.  Maybe, in time and with practice, I could build frogs from the Peco templates but it begs the question why would I want to - by the time I've gained sufficient expertise, Peco will be producing the real Mcoy again .......................

If I were to go into hand made points, it certainly wouldn't be so that I could turn Peco Insulfrogs into Electrofrogs.  It would be for the better look and flexibility of hand-made ones.






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 Posted: Thu May 21st, 2020 04:14 pm
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BCDR
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Hi Peter,

Your last paragraph sums it up. The reason I went to DIY. 

Nigel




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 Posted: Thu May 21st, 2020 06:01 pm
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Petermac
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That's indisputable Nigel - much better looking points that RTR.  Unfortunately, not all of us have the skill, the time or the inclination to build our own.

Within reason, I want to get the layout up and running as near perfectly as I can so that I can concentrate on the scenic side of things.



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 Posted: Fri May 22nd, 2020 05:30 am
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Briperran
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I certainly agree with Peters last post.
I think everyone would love to be in the position of making all their track and pointwork but you have to factor in a number of thing to go down that route. How big is the layout you intend to make if it an 8ft plank with say 10 sets of points perhaps fine but with a larger layout with 60 plus sets of points that would be a large undertaking. Bearing in mind not everyone has masses of time they can spend working on the layout and with the many different facets of building a layout one does have to make compromises to actually stand a chance of getting close to at least say you have nearly completed it.  And im sure we are all the same we start but we change and add things as we go along thus extending the build time anyway.

Brian



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 Posted: Fri May 22nd, 2020 07:48 am
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Then look at this one
http://www.nmra.org.au/Layout_Tours/Rowan%20Mangion/indexB.html

403 turnouts to build



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 Posted: Fri May 22nd, 2020 08:03 am
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Petermac
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But I note that he's only built 247 so far - and he started in 2008 !!!

What a layout - and what a train room !!!

I wonder what his day job is ........................ :roll: :roll: :roll:



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 Posted: Fri May 22nd, 2020 01:49 pm
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Petermac
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I've just spent an interesting but frustrating half hour surfing for the replacement points I'll need.

I found a shop in UK which appeared to hold some stock - and at a decent price too.  All was well until it came to the delivery page.  The only address option I was offered was UK !!

Why do organisations advertise on the WORLD WIDE web when they'll only trade with the next street !?  Is it xenophobia or don't they know the world doesn't stop at Watford .............................

Further surfing threw up Amazon.de  I've bought from Amazon Germany in the past becuase they're often much cheaper than Amazon.fr.

Yes, they too had some stock - priced at €81.70 ex Germany !!!!

"Ebay next",  thinks I.  Bear in mind, these points have a RRP of a tad under £15.  I did find some (carfeully used) for as little as £7.99.  Postage to France ?  £11.99 !!!!  Apparently, it's Ebay who fix the International postage charges, not the seller.  No idea if that's true or not but I have heard that postal costs have hit Ebay sellers very hard over the last couple of years.

I was genuinely surprised at some of the prices being asked for both new and used points.  All I can think is that people are cashing in on the current shortage of stock from Peco.  Maybe I should see if there's any interest in the box full of Insulfrogs I've gathered as I swapped them out in favour of Electrofrogs ...............

Just wondering if I ought to post this in Room 101 rather than on my Maxmill thread .......................... :hmm



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 Posted: Fri May 22nd, 2020 08:50 pm
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Barry Miltenburg
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Peter

What happens if you buy them with a UK delivery address?  Could one of us in the UK post them to you without busting the bank?  Not sure what weight you are contemplating but I can't believe that we cannot sort something out amongst members

Barry

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 Posted: Sat May 23rd, 2020 07:24 am
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Petermac
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I did think of sending them to one of my kids - both UK based - for onward posting Barry. 

I do have a bit of a bee in my bonnet about companies refusing to trade outside UK now wer're firmly in an era of global markets.  There was a time when trading overseas anywhere was a risky business but not today.  It's either xenophobic or small minded - whilst I understand it's their choice who they trade with, similarly it's mine.

Since I moved to France, I tend to avoid companies who refuse to deal with me.



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 Posted: Sat May 23rd, 2020 04:04 pm
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Barry Miltenburg
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Peter, I know it won't make you feel any better but when we wanted stuff delivered to our house on the Isle of Wight, a lot of companies just said "no" - as if that little bit of water was a major barrier.

I can appreciate that you avoid those with such narrow-minded attitudes.

Barry

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 Posted: Sat May 23rd, 2020 04:18 pm
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Petermac
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I'm not surprised Barry - after all, the Isle of Wight is abroad !!!

I once wanted to take a hired lorry to Northern Ireland and was told "No, we don't allow foreign use" !   It didn't make any difference when I pointed out that Northern Ireland was no more "foreign" than Scotland or Wales.

I really can't see their argument for mail order - you'll know better than I that a UK card payment is safe for a UK company wherever the holder happens to live.  Maybe they don't like the Post Office .................



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 Posted: Sat May 23rd, 2020 05:11 pm
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We live in Central Scotland, literally 1.3miles on a Main A road to the nearest Junction on the M9.  When trying to place a sizeable order with a company they quoted £150 for delivery as there system insisted we were Highlands and Islands despite me pointing them to our location on google maps. They were quite surprised when we declined to go ahead with the order, and then ordered elsewhere at a more normal £28 delivery  :roll:

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 Posted: Sat May 23rd, 2020 06:01 pm
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Petermac
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Scotland has often presented delivery problems from England Matt.

As you say, unless they use a map, most have absolutely no idea of Scottish geography - anything north of Edinburgh is the "Highlands" and only accessible during the summer months .....................

My brother lives in Angus and many consider that to be almost in the Arctic Circle.................



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