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Perry
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After carrying out research on the internet and in various books, I have decided to scratchbuild a No.2 Coaling Plant. I was fortunate enough to find plans and photographs that should provide sufficient information to allow a reasonably accurate model to be built.

I printed the plans and then resized them on a photocopier to give me a 2mm=1ft scale drawing; half actual size. It is then simple to take measurements from the drawing in millimetres and double them to give the dimensions of the part being fabricated. I expect to have to make small adjustments of a few millimetres here and there to cater for the thickness of various materials, but the overall appearance and proportions should be pretty close to the prototype.

A coaling plant is basically a simple series of box structures set on legs, so it should not be too difficult to construct.

The wooden frame.

 I didn’t fancy making up square section legs from plastikard. It seemed a waste of time and material, so I opted for 6mm square stripwood.

Four pieces, each 220 mm long, were cut to form the legs of the structure. Four pieces, 148mm long, were cut to form the main longitudinal bearers and four more, 60mm long, for the transverse bearers.

A line was marked around each leg 64mm from the bottom end. This will be the lowest level of the loading platform over the coaling road. The top bearers will be attached flush with the top end of the legs.



 
The pieces of wood were glued up using impact adhesive, ensuring all the joints were square. The joints between the pieces of wood will eventually all be covered with plastikard so this should be sufficient to reinforce the simple butt joints.



The main carcase of the structure will be made from 0.040" plastikard.
Perry

Last edited on Sun Dec 19th, 2010 11:15 am by Perry

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I think you could have a career with IKEA, Perry.

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Is the main body of a No. 2 Coaling plant made from plain slabs of concrete ?
If so, and seeing as you're almost a full convert to card modelling ( I'm citing your recent foray into oil tanks as an example), you could use the excellent Scalescenes concrete prints over a card body, rather than plasticard...
Stu

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The platform base and lower cladding has been constructed and temporarily fitted:



The two coal chutes form a unit that fits above the platform. It's quite a complex shape, so I thought I'd save time and material by designing it using Sketchup 8. http://sketchup.google.com/ I can input the important (and known) dimensions, and this clever little freebee will work out all the other dimensions, angles, etc. of all the required panels. The only thing I need to bear in mind is the thickness of the material I'm using and make adjustments accordingly when cutting out.

Here are three views of the assembly I need to build:







By loading the saved design back into Sketchup 8 I can measure any given dimension quickly and easily. This is a superb tool for scratchbuilders.

Hopefully I will continue construction tomorrow.

Perry

Perry
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Work has begun on the twin coal chute assembly.

I constructed a false 'floor' for the bunker and added side panels wich will facilitate locating and fixing the assembly in place when it is complete.

The corners were cut away to fit around the legs. This will also be done to the chutes at a later stage.

Marking out and cutting the various angles for the panels was a breeze using the Sketchup 8 plans. The following picture shows one funnel base assembled and stood in place on the false floor. Please note, the whole thing is being built upside down! The four cut out parts in the foreground are the second funnel prepared for assembly.



The only other work carried out today was to insert a piece of 5mm foamboard beneath the main platform to give it a bit of 'bulk' and to ensure that when other details are added, the correct clearance for the loco road is maintained.

Perry

Perry
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This very old picture of a No.2 Coaling Plant was found somewhere on the internet a long time ago. I can't find it again despite spending some considerable time trying. I hope that there are no copyright issues, but if its appearance here causes anyone any problems or concerns, then please accept my apologies and rest assured that I will remove it as soon as possible.

This then, is the prototype upon which this model is based:



It looks as though I'm going to have to cut a pit in the baseboard to accomodate the wagon hoist machinery! :shock:

Perry

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is this link with pics any good Perry,

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php/blog/116/entry-5129-barrow-road-coaling-tower/ or this one

Plant half way down the page, http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=lXQYpDyjBYAC&pg=PA162&lpg=PA162&dq=wagon+hoist+Coaling+Plant&source=bl&ots=
7F_Yy2EclA&sig=qT-q3bu9dC3Zeo5mlbZ0iewcV_M&hl=en&ei=0EQPTeDPI4PMhAexr_W2Dg&sa=
X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CEIQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q&f=false


Or this one, it explains about a tube cleaner for the Loco's which was part of the plant or MPD http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahnbetriebswerk_(steam_locomotives)

Phill

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Why did they have to make them so big ? You can see how high above the loco the wagon is already - it seems to be an awfuly large building to store coal - an easier way would have been a lower wagon hoist and a conveyor belt to move the coal up higher....

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Another interesting project Perry. It would be good to get an idea of scale. Just how high is this thing in 00 scale?

Bob(K)

Perry
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Novice wrote: Another interesting project Perry. It would be good to get an idea of scale. Just how high is this thing in 00 scale?

Bob(K)

When completed it will be roughly 340mm tall, Bob. This is actually one of the smaller types and was used at secondary depots (like mine). The height of the real thing was about 85 feet!

Perry

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phill wrote: is this link with pics any good Perry,

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php/blog/116/entry-5129-barrow-road-coaling-tower/ or this one

Plant half way down the page, http://books.google.co.uk/books?id=lXQYpDyjBYAC&pg=PA162&lpg=PA162&dq=wagon+hoist+Coaling+Plant&source=bl&ots=
7F_Yy2EclA&sig=qT-q3bu9dC3Zeo5mlbZ0iewcV_M&hl=en&ei=0EQPTeDPI4PMhAexr_W2Dg&sa=
X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CEIQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q&f=false


Or this one, it explains about a tube cleaner for the Loco's which was part of the plant or MPD http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bahnbetriebswerk_(steam_locomotives)

Phill

Thanks Phill.

I had seen the Barrow Road site before. Nice work!

The second link appears to show an Ash Plant, if I'm looking at the right part of the page. Very useful though, as I also have to build one of them at some stage.

Perry

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Stubby47 wrote: Why did they have to make them so big ? You can see how high above the loco the wagon is already - it seems to be an awfuly large building to store coal - an easier way would have been a lower wagon hoist and a conveyor belt to move the coal up higher....

Stu your comment there i found relavant some years ago i made up the superquick coaling plant which is similar to Perrys one.

The kit was fine cheap to buy easy to build.

Im positioned it on the layout and it looked stupidly to big totally out of place so i imediately removed it.

A lesson learned there think before you buy something will it actually look right in the surroundings.

Brian

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Perry wrote: Novice wrote: Another interesting project Perry. It would be good to get an idea of scale. Just how high is this thing in 00 scale?

Bob(K)

When completed it will be roughly 340mm tall, Bob. This is actually one of the smaller types and was used at secondary depots (like mine). The height of the real thing was about 85 feet!

Perry



Wow, that's over a foot in real money. You are going to need a high backscene, so that it does not poke over the top of your layout.

Bob(K)

Perry
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I had already considered the height of my backscene and have catered for it. :thumbs These plants really dominated the areas in which they stood. I think they were magnificent.

All the parts for the feeder chutes have been cut out and one of them assembled:



The gap where it joins the main assembly is only there because it is propped in position for the photo and not yet glued up.

I'll get the other one made up, then, after the glue is well and truly hard, just tidy up a little with a small file or sandpaper. The fit of the parts in general terms has come out so well after using the Sketchup design method that very little tidying or filling is needed.

It looks as though the days of hand-drawn plans and card mock-ups are rapidly going out of fashion. :brickwall

Perry

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The chute assembly has been completed and is in place, although not glued in yet. I'm thinking it might be easier to paint before permanent fixing takes place.

I spent a little while this evening designing the hood, winding gear housing and other structures that sit atop the part I've already built. I'm happy with the way it looks with a nice big loco sitting beneath it. Impressive! (The coaling plant, not my modelling. :oops:)

I might be able to post another picture or two tomorrow.

Perry

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The modelling is impressive too, Perry.

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I can also sense another monthly project subject being developed - how to draw complex shapes using Sketchup.

Perry
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Stubby47 wrote: I can also sense another monthly project subject being developed - how to draw complex shapes using Sketchup.

Ooh, good! I would find that very useful. :cool wink

Seriously, I don't think there is a need for it. There are many video help files available on the internet that explain the procedures far better than I could. It's not something I could explain very easily using static images, and I'm only a beginner too. This software is capable of doing far more than I will ever need, but once the basics are grasped, it's easy to use.

Here are some images of the design for the top housing:







The shape and dimensions were taken from the plans so it may not tally exactly with the photo of the prototype. No two plants were exactly the same anyway.

No details such as windows or doors have been drawn in yet, so there is still a bit to do before construction commences.

Perry


Last edited on Tue Dec 21st, 2010 07:00 am by Perry

Perry
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Now that assembly of the chutes has been completed, the corners have been cut away to accomodate the main legs.



Holes have been cut in the platform to allow the chutes to protrude below:



The flat 'walls' above the chutes will be glued inside the bunker walls in due course. There is still a lot more work to do on the platform as it is only a single thickness of 0.040" plastikard supported on 5mm foamboard at present. This was installed to ensure that the correct clearances are maintained. It would be no joke to finish loads of work and then find a large loco couldn't pass beneath it! :shock:

The 9F gives some indication of the scale of the project.

Perry

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very impressive, they were in real life too.we had a full size one on Teesside
it dominated the sky line for miles around.

:doublethumb:lol::cool:

Perry
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I cut the two end panels for the housing from 0.040" plastikard using the design and measurements from the Sketchup plans. I then cut further strips of plastikard to form the side walls and ledges, reinforcing the corners with triangular plates.



The top panel needed a couple of small windows for the winding room wall.

I decided it would be a good idea to carry out a temporary dry assembly, using masking tape, to make sure everything was fitting together OK.



I stood it on the layout to see what the overall effect was. It didn't overpower everything, balanced as it was by the large engine shed close by. The whiteness of the plastikard looked a bit stark, but painting will eventually tone that down.

I'm happy that it's all coming together properly and feel that the hardest part of the build is now over so I can press on and finish the main fabrication.

Perry


Last edited on Tue Dec 21st, 2010 02:21 pm by Perry

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Given that the real buildings were full of coal and machinery and the overhanging hood was probably of a lighter construction, how stable / top heavy is the model ?

Perry
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Stability is reasonably good at the moment. I think that when the wagon hoisting gear is added, that will brace it somewhat as well. The small buildings and platform at gound level should also improve matters when they are added.

Perry

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Hello Perry,
Excellent modelling, mate. This should fit-in to your Lay-out very nicely. Well done,
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.

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I had a little bit of fun 'freestyling' this morning, making up a pair of  'jigger drives'. I've not been able to find a definitive design - or any design at all, for that matter - so I made something that I think looks like a bit of fairly heavy machinery.



I made a mirror-image pair of these from scrap plastikard and sprue. They are about 35mm long, 20mm wide and 15mm high. They will fit on the lower platform with the shafts connected to the coal chutes.

Perry

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That looks suitably "heavy" Perry - whatever they'ere supposed to do .................:thumbs

p.s. Are you still allowed to say "jigger" drives ?........................:mutley:mutley  I think a "jigger" of rum is a no-no  :roll:.

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It appears they operate the 'jigger feeder' - and no, I'm not kidding; it's actually annotated as such on the plans!  It is something to do with feeding the coal from the bunkers through the chutes. There are a couple of small buildings at the base of the structure which hold the 'jigger feeder controls', so I'm guessing the operator could control the rate at which the coal was fed into the tender.

Perry

Last edited on Thu Dec 23rd, 2010 08:04 pm by Perry

Perry
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A little more progress has been made with the main platform edged off, plating around the chutes and the exposed 'edges' on the upper part have been added, along with the protruding girders right at the top.

The jigger drives have been put it place and the main bunker has been glued up - hence the tape securing it whilst it dries.

The exposed wood of the legs has yet to be covered in plastikard. Some of the edges and joins still have to be smoothed.

The small cabins at the base will be designed and built next.



The overall height is 342mm.

Perry

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That's about 13 1/2" in the old money, Perry.  My coaling tower is over 300.  They look OK when they're in context.  It's great building something big, isn't it?

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MaxSouthOz wrote: That's about 13 1/2" in the old money, Perry.  My coaling tower is over 300.  They look OK when they're in context.  It's great building something big, isn't it?
You're exactly right, Max. 13 1/2" is spot on.

I made the mistake of not allowing sufficient space for buildings on my previous layout and was determined not to do the same again. By physically having most of the buildings to hand when I start tracklaying, I will be sure that everything will look as I want it to (I nearly said 'right' :shock:) and that clearances, etc., will be OK. Part of the initial plan was to include this beastie in a layout because they have always fascinated me. I also want an ash plant. This is currently in the design stage. Apart from wanting plenty of room for several big locos, I felt that a large loco shed would be needed to visually balance such large structures as the coal and ash plants. A small shed would have looked lost.

Perry

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I think it's looking very good.
You'll enjoy the painting too.

Perry
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ddolfelin wrote: I think it's looking very good.
You'll enjoy the painting too.

I'll probably need a 4" brush! :mutley

Perry

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How many rivets will be needed?

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That is looking great Perry! It looks top heavy or should I say tippy? How do you intend to anchor it so it will be solid or the layout?

My luck I'd just keep knocking it over every time I worked around it.

Wayne

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Wayne Williams wrote: That is looking great Perry! It looks top heavy or should I say tippy? How do you intend to anchor it so it will be solid or the layout?

My luck I'd just keep knocking it over every time I worked around it.

Wayne

Thanks for the kind comments, Wayne.

A six-inch nail or two driven in with a 3-pound hammer at an angle through the legs should hold it! :mutley:mutley:mutley

Actually, it is surprisingly stable. The plastikard construction is quite light and it doesn't appear to want to fall over by itself. The truck rails should make it even more stable - when I get around to making them. I think the real solution will be to glue a small square of plastikard beneath each of the legs and to secure them - probably with double-sided tape or pins -  to the baseboard, before hiding them with scenic materials. The trouble with making it too rigidly held in place is that a slight nudge may cause damage. I'll just have to be careful!

Perry

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ddolfelin wrote: How many rivets will be needed?
Er, none - it's plastic!!!! :mutley:mutley:mutley The prototype was concrete, so that probably had the same amount. :doublethumb

Perry

Last edited on Fri Dec 24th, 2010 01:06 pm by Perry

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Hello Perry,
A brilliant model, mate, and very well designed/engineered. Perhaps 4 x L brackets secured to "concrete footings" and the leg-uprights. Your Lay-out is looking GReAAAAT,
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.

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I glued up the bottom half of the structure last evening, then cut and fitted all the leg shrouds from 0.040" plastikard - 32 pieces in all! :shock: I haven't glued the jigger drives in place yet, because I want to paint them before they're fitted, and I want to spray the entire structure with primer and a base 'concrete' colour first.

I've sneaked off to my 'modelling suite' (spare room) to do a bit more filing and sanding this morning before anyone misses me - not that that's likely to happen. Apart from my youngest son, who's watching TV, there's no-one else here - not even SWMBO.

Have a good day, guys.

Perry :cheers

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I was looking at the jigger drives this morning when I discovered that one of them had suffered from 'creep' - similar to, but on a much small scale than Max's problem, but a damn nuisance all the same. One of the drive shafts had slipped when the glue was drying and was noticeably out of alignment. I had to carefully cut the front end apart and remake it. It was probably only a millimetre or two out, but it stuck out like the proverbial sore thumb. I have a very keen eye for things being level and this certainly wasn't! :thud

Perry

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I'm with you, Perry.  exclam:

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We have all had that experience Perry, and I'm quite sure it's not over for anyone.

That is one reason I like this forum. I take pictures to post and while doing that I notice things that one cannot see on the model. Some I correct, and some I do not.

Those pesky ones that are not level, seem the worst though.

Wayne

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The joints and seams on the coaling lightly plant have been filled and sanded today and the whole thing now looks a lot tidier. I have also sanded all the flat surfaces to give the paint a better key.

I'm about to start work on building the jigger feeder control cabins. They are pretty straightforward box-like structures on legs abutting the short access platforms.

I still haven't permanently joined the top and bottom sections of the plant together because it is such a large model that it is easier to handle in two parts. I don't need to join them until I'm ready to install the wagon hoist and counterbalance rails.

I'm really enjoying seeing this model take shape.

Perry

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Well just caught up on this and i must say its a brilliant model you did there mate, as always you are the master builder on this Forum.

Phill

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:oops::oops::oops::oops::oops:

Thanks, Phill. Glad you're enjoying it.

Perry

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Here is a quick photo update showing progress so far:



The control cabins and their respective platforms have been fabricated and the upper and lower leg sections have all been covered with 0.040" plastikard. The two boxes at the lower front will form the counterweight receivers. The jigger drives are still not fixed in place. One or two areas that have been filled are still to be sanded down.

The counterweight supports and the truck hoist rails will be put in soon - probably after the handrails and steps have been fitted to the platforms. The gap between the two platforms will eventually hold part of the truck hoist mechanism.

There isn't much to see on the back of the structure at present. I still have to fit the many sections of stairways and handrails, but plan on using Plastruct components for most of these.

I've guestimated that track centres for the coaling and truck hoist roads will be approximately 100mm (4"), so although the whole thing looks enormous, it's 'footprint' isn't too bad.

Perry


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That is a big structure & presumably a lot of weight too just on those 4 legs.

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Sol wrote: That is a big structure & presumably a lot of weight too just on those 4 legs.
I'm guessing that the amount of reinforced concrete forming the structure itself was pretty heavy. :shock: According to the plans, each of the two hoppers held a maximum of 75 tons of coal. Each coal wagon used to fill them held between 8 and 20 tons - plus the weight of the wagon, so it must have been a pretty robust piece of kit to be able to lift enough of them each day to keep the hoppers topped up.

Fortunately, 0.040" Plastikard isn't too heavy!!!! :mutley

Perry

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Apart from the odd detail or two to be added in the final stages, the two control cabins and their respective platforms have been completed.



The boxes at the front are the counterweight receivers. The gaps between the cabin and the handrails are where the assembly fits aound the main legs of the structure.

The access steps are made from Plastruct, part number STAS-4. The handrails were made by drilling 1mm holes in the decking and glueing in vertically some 10mm lengths of 1mm round microstrip.The hand rails were also made from the same material and were joined to the uprights by tiny amounts of tube polystyrene cement. Solvent is unsuitable for this task due to the tiny area of contact between the parts. It would leave the joint far too weak. At the top of the steps, the bend in the handrail was made 'cold' by gently tweaking the plastic rod to the required angle with a pair of tweezers (forceps). Bends any sharper than this would normally require the application of heat to prevent breakages.

Perry

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Simple little structures, but done very well indeed.

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I agree, they are just simple constructions, Stu, but there's still a surprising amount of work in them. I had to make about 90 separate parts in all. :shock: They were 'fiddly' rather than difficult.

Perry

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I wasn't suggesting they were easy at all, but I wouldn't have guessed at 90 components each :???:!

I think what most impresses me is your ability to cut things square, so the sides all fit properly !

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Stubby47 wrote: I wasn't suggesting they were easy at all, but I wouldn't have guessed at 90 components each :???:!

I think what most impresses me is your ability to cut things square, so the sides all fit properly !

Ninety components in total, Stu, - not in each one. Sorry if I misled you.

They were easy to build though. It's just a couple of boxes and platforms on legs.

Squareness and accuracy of things has improved with practice. Some of my early projects were really horrible by comparison. :oops:

Before I start to mark out a part, I check the material to make sure I'm measuring from 2 straight sides joined at a 90 degree angle. It doesn't matter about the other sides. I mark the right-angle corner so that I know which sides I'm working from. All cuts are made using a steel straight-edge and most measuring and marking out is done with a steel ruler, marked down to 0.5mm divisions, and a sharp knife. I discovered long ago that pencil lines are way too thick and inaccurate for small work. I know I've said this on the forum before, but if a part isn't right, I throw it in the 'bits box' and make another one. It saves time and temper in the long run.

Perry

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Now those really look sharp Perry. Are you going to add windows and doors to them?

I know what you mean when you said "If a part isn't right throw it in the bit's box". I also know how difficult that can be a times, but it is the right decision. With all the time (and materials) that go into scratch building, don't settle for less than you are capable of.

Lesson well learned!

Wayne

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Wayne Williams wrote: Now those really look sharp Perry. Are you going to add windows and doors to them?....

Wayne

I'm not planning to, Wayne. These cabins only housed the controls for the jigger drives and I doubt that there were many, or indeed any, 'home comforts'. Once they're covered in grime and coal dust, I think they'll look the part.

Perry

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I am now at the stage of needing to put some handrails around the ege of the main platform where the jigger drives are situated.

I considered drilling holes for the uprights directly into the deck but wasn't happy I could get them all close enough to perpendicular.

I therefore went for a bit of a compromise; a practical solution.

I am using 2mm x 1mm (0.080" x 0.040") microstrip, marked out to give the chosen upright spacings. These are drilled with a series of 1mm holes. The strip is then taped down onto a sheet of glass to hold it flat whilst the uprights, cut from 1mm plastic rod, are pushed into place. Pushing them down until they touch the glass ensures they all protrude by the same amount. A touch of solvent holds each one in place.

Another length of 1mm rod is then glued across the tops of the uprights with tube polystyrene cement. When this is partially set, any tiny lateral adjustments needed can be made.


The first photo shows the end units as built on the bench.




The second photo shows one of the units stood in place, but not fixed. The gap will house the access steps in due course.



Perry

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love them Perry, a joy to see them coming together, the bonus is learning too..
:doublethumb:lol::lol::cool:

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I think the rails could be space a tad to the right more and the cabins to the left about half a mill :twisted: :mutley

 

Apart from that they look great mate :thumbs

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That's very helpful, Perry.  I've got to make handrails which run the length of the NR.  Some useful tips there.  :thumbs

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phill wrote: I think the rails could be space a tad to the right more and the cabins to the left about half a mill :twisted: :mutley

 

Apart from that they look great mate :thumbs

Phill

Modifications carried out as requested, Phill! :mutley

:cheers

Perry

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I'm in the process of making several sets of handrails and thought it might be helpful to show a photo of the work in progress.

For these two sets, I cut two pieces of 2mm x 1mm microstrip, 236mm long, and taped them to a sheet of glass with masking tape. If you are working on glass for flatness, (which I recommend you do) it's essential to tape the bases down, otherwise they skid all over the place when you're working on them.

I worked out with a calculator what the spacing between the uprights was going to be and set a pair of spring dividers to the correct dimension. Starting from the centre of each base strip, I 'walked' the compasses out to the ends, being careful to prick the location of each upright as close to the centre-line of the strip as possible.

The base strips were then removed from the glass and laid on some scrap foamboard for drilling. This was carried out using a 1mm drill bit in a pin-vice. Care should be taken to keep the drill-bit as vertical as possible when drilling - it makes things a lot easier later on.

After all the holes were drilled, the burrs were lightly sanded off both sides of the strips. It might be necessary to just run the drill-bit through each hole again to clear them out completely.

Straighten the strips gently between the fingers if they have become bent out of shape, then tape them back down onto the glass.

I have the luxury of a 'chopper' to cut the uprights quickly and accurately, so I measured the required length and set a temporary stop on the chopper bed. I cut all the uprights required, plus a few spares, in one session.

It's then a quick and easy process to push an upright into each hole, pressing down gently until you feel it touch the glass.
They should be a snug fit.

When they are all in place, put a small amount of solvent around the base of each one with a brush. The solvent will soften the upright slightly, so you have a chance to tweak any that don't look absolutely vertical. Keep checking as the solvent goes off aa they sometimes move out of line when you're not looking!

Put the assemblies aside to set hard. When they're ready, put a small blob of tube polystyrene cement on the top of each upright with a cocktail stick or similar implement and lower the handrail into place. Tube cement will give you plenty of time for adjustment before it sets. I find it pays to wait a few seconds after applying the cement before putting the rail in place, because it becomes much 'tackier' and grips better initially.

Here are the two long sets under construction:



Perry


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I now know how make the rails for my long viaduct, mine were a real cock -up.
I love this forum me...

:thumbs:lol::lol::cool:

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I have just come up with an alternative method for fixing the handrail onto the tops of the uprights.

I taped a metal straightedge to my sheet of glass, then pressed the handrail against it, thereby keeping it straight and in place.

The base strip, already fitted with uprights, was laid on it's side, with the top of the uprights touching the handrail. Working left to right (or the other way if you're left-handed), press the upright against the handrail and apply a small amount of solvent to the joint. Hold in place for a few seconds, then move on to the next one. This method gives time to adjust the position of each upright before the solvent is applied.

In the following photo, I have fixed the first four uprights and am working my way along to the right.



Once the whole lot has set hard, I plan to reinforce each joint with a touch of tube cement.

This method is a lot less tricky than trying to get the handrail in place with the uprights all waving about in the air.

I'll update again if I run into any snags.

Perry

Last edited on Sat Jan 1st, 2011 10:24 am by Perry

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This worked fine. :thumbs

I fixed the handrails to two bases with eleven uprights each in a matter of seconds. It's much faster, more accurate and less hassle than the original method. In fact, I would say it is at least five times as fast and twice as accurate.

I'm going to let the solvent dry for several hours before I start reinforcing the joints with tube cement. I'm also only going to do the reinforcing a bit at a time; perhaps a third or half of the uprights before allowing drying time, just as a precaution.

I find I get my best ideas after a drop or two of Scottish falling-down water! :thud

I have three more long sets and some short sections still to make, but all of sudden it doesn't seem such an onerous task.

Perry

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Ah - you've answered my question Perry.

You'd said earlier that you use tube cement because solvent is too "fine", then you said solvent with this new method - now I understand why - the tube cement will follow. :thumbs

That "flat" system must be much easier than trying to stick the handrail onto floating uprights and it looks such an obvious thing to do - once someone else has discovered it.................:roll::roll::cheers

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Exactly so; the solvent will only be used for 'tacking' the uprights in place. It's fast to do and easy to adjust the position if required.

The tube cement will give it strength but doesn't have the instant 'grab' of solvent.

Perry

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Perry,
What exactly is the polystyrene tube cement?
Wayne

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The stuff I have here on my bench is marketed by Humbrol and the printing on the tube states, "Poly Cement'. It's the glue used a lot by builders of plastic kits; just the common or garden polystyrene cement. Any hobby shop will have this or it's equivalent. I call it 'tube' cement because it comes in a 'toothpaste tube' type container and to distinguish it from solvent which is liquid and comes in a bottle. It is quite viscous.

Perry

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Top tip there Perry, i take it using glass doesn't let the Mek bond to it? it's coming on lovely can't wait to see the painting stage i shall continue to lurk.

Regards

Pete

Last edited on Sun Jan 2nd, 2011 07:35 am by wogga

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wogga wrote: Top tip there Perry, i take it using glass doesn't let the Mek bond to it? it's coming on lovely can't wait to see the painting stage i shall continue to lurk.

Regards

Pete

I basically use two surfaces for my modelling; a cutting mat for marking out and cutting on, and a thick piece of glass for construction and glueing up. (I do a lot of my marking out with a knife.)

As you quite rightly say, solvent doesn't bond to glass and neither do many other adhesives, although obviously some do. :shock:  Paint, glue, PVA, you name it, it will all scrape off easily with an old utility knife blade I keep for the purpose.

For keeping stuff flat and square, you can't beat a piece of glass.

By the way, don't EVER try cutting or drilling down onto the glass. Even if it doesn't harm the glass, it will blunt the tools very quickly and there is always the danger of the blade or bit slipping and causing injury.

Enjoy your 'lurking'! :thumbs

Perry

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A good idea about using glass for assembly Perry.

Does it have ground edges and is it pretty thick ?

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Petermac wrote: A good idea about using glass for assembly Perry.

Does it have ground edges and is it pretty thick ?

The piece of glass I use was originally a sliding door from a piece of furniture. It's 4mm thick and 370mms x 220mm in size. It has nicely ground edges and corners.  One side has a ground-in recess that formed a handle for sliding the panel open. I have yet to discover a use for that! I usually use the glass with the handle side downwards anyway.

Perry

P.S. I've just though of a use for the handle recess: I could use it to store small parts during construction to stop them rolling away! :thumbs

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Great stuff, Perry.

"A good idea about using glass for assembly."
Yes, although it depends what's in it.

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I can't build the railings for the very lowest level of the hoisting gear housing until the upper part of the assembly is permanently mounted on the lower part because a stairway and handrails bridge the two.

Apart from that, fabrication on this side of the structure is pretty much finished.





Since posting these images, I've spotted a misalignment on one part of the handrail that I will have to fix! :oops:

Overall though, I'm reasonably happy with the results, given that my eyesight and hands aren't as good as they were. :roll:

That's one more job to tick off my 'To Do' list. :brickwall

The counterweight rails and wagon platform and hoist are next. :thumbs

Perry


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That really does look good Perry - in spite of the wonky handrail. :thumbs

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lPetermac wrote: That really does look good Perry - in spite of the wonky handrail. :thumbs
 

Thank you.  The wonky handrail is wonky no more!

I've just fitted the long handrails to the lower deck, so it's really starting to come together now. :doublethumb

The end is in sight! - well, almost. :shock:

Perry

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Looking good, Perry.  I reckon I'll put the glass over the blown up blueprints when I do my handrails.  :thumbs

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That's a first class job Perry  :thumbs  very impressive.

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Think I'm growing to hate you:twisted:.....:lol:

Looking real good Perry:thumbs

Perry wrote: I can't build the railings for the very lowest level of the hoisting gear housing until the upper part of the assembly is permanently mounted on the lower part because a stairway and handrails bridge the two.

Apart from that, fabrication on this side of the structure is pretty much finished.





Since posting these images, I've spotted a misalignment on one part of the handrail that I will have to fix! :oops:

Overall though, I'm reasonably happy with the results, given that my eyesight and hands aren't as good as they were. :roll:

That's one more job to tick off my 'To Do' list. :brickwall

The counterweight rails and wagon platform and hoist are next. :thumbs

Perry



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MaxSouthOz wrote: Looking good, Perry.  I reckon I'll put the glass over the blown up blueprints when I do my handrails.  :thumbs
That's a neat idea, Max. However, a word of caution; depending on how thick the piece of glass is, be careful that it doesn't lead to optical distortion because of the angle you are looking at it from. (Parallax) The thicker the glass, the more pronounced the distortion.

For example, in my case, the glass is 4mm thick. If I were to lay the glass over a dot marked on a piece of paper and make a mark on the glass with a wax pencil exactly over the dot, then move my head slightly, the mark would no longer appear to be over the dot. Bearing in mind the accuracy required in building something like your loco, it could throw the whole lot out of kilter.

Ask me how I know this..............or better still....don't. :sad:

 I hope I'm not "teaching granny to suck eggs" here and you probably know more than me about parallax issues, but I wouldn't want you to build your handrails using this method and then discover they don't fit. :shock:

Perry

Last edited on Mon Jan 3rd, 2011 08:41 am by Perry

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Perry wrote: , but I wouldn't want you to build your handrails using this method and then discover they don't fit. :shock:

Perry


Perry, if he did find they did not fit, I would hear the explosion from where I live 35 miles away & see the mushroom cloud exclam:

I have felt the ground shake a couple of times while he has been building the loco.

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:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley

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Hmmm.  Parallax - maybe I'll use Gladwrap.  :hmm

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MaxSouthOz wrote: Hmmm.  Parallax - maybe I'll use Gladwrap.  :hmm
Is that a type of clingfilm, Max? That should work, but I'd test it with the solvent first - just in case....

.......................................................................


I've given the interior of the upper assembly of the coaling plant a coat of acrylic primer this morning after masking inside the windows with some tape. During the planning stage it became apparent that once the upper and lower parts of the model are joined together, masking up and getting any paint inside it would be nigh on impossible. It's the 6 P's again...:thumbs

Once the primer is thoroughly dry, I'll put a coat or two of Vallejo's 'Black-Grey' over the whole of the inside. No weathering is required because it very little of the interior will be visible when the model is assembled. It's just to get rid of the whiteness of the plastikard.

I'm pleased with the scratchbuilt handrails around the lower deck. Now they're set hard and have been trimmed to length, they look OK.

Once the aforementioned painting is done, I'll join the two main structures so that I can get on with the final two sets of stairs and handrails before moving on to fabricating the wagon hoist supports and guide rails.

Perhaps while I'm waiting for the primer, etc., to dry, I could get on with painting the jigger drives......:hmm

Perry

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Perry,
Those hand rails look fantastic. I'd say you have nailed the process on how to do it.

I will have to start looking for a piece of glass. As you know I have a lot of brick-brack to build.

Wayne

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Did you spray paint the primer Perry ?  If so, was it the Halford's type or do you have a airbrush ?

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I brush-painted the primer on the inside, although I do have an airbrush. It's a very confined space in which to to wield an airbrush and I thought that a brush would be easier for this particular task. I used Vallejo Grey Primer which works pretty well as long as there's no grease on the model (which there shouldn't be anyway.)

I intend to airbrush the exterior.

Perry


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Thanks for that Perry. :thumbs

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I've been rather busy with other things today, so only a little progress has been made on the coaling plant.

I have built the back upright frame of the wagon hoist, which turned out to be more complicated than I first thought, involving fabricating 23 separate parts. It hasn't been joined to the wagon platform yet, as I need to ensure that it aligns with the slightly angled hoist supports, yet to be built.

I also fabricated two sets of guide rails for the counterweights. These were formed by cutting four lengths of 0.080" square plastic strip and making up a pair of 'ladders', with the vertical elements 14mm apart. This was achieved by using some scrap plastikard cut to 14mm wide as temporary spacers. The cross supports, made from microstrip, were fitted at abitrary distances apart along the length of the rails, compared to photographs and the plans.

Providing I can obtain the styrene channel material I want tomorrow, the main hoist supports will follow shortly. If it was only a short length of 'H'-beam that I needed, I would make my own, but I need about 450mm (18") in all and I don't want to risk it looking 'wonky'! If a long piece such as this was even a couple of millimetres out of true over it's length, it would look completely wrong.

I now have a number of sub-assemblies ready to put together, but I intend at least getting a coat of primer on them all before final assembly. I need to ensure that the areas that will be glued remain free of paint. Sticking paint to paint doesn't hold much together at all! :roll:

When I have the sub-assemblies ready, I will try to photograph them as a 'set' to illustrate how a structure such as this doesn't have to be built 'from the ground up' and can be built in different parts to form a sort of 'construction kit'. One of the advantages of this method is that if a sub-assembly goes wrong or is accidentaly damaged, there isn't so much work involved to re-make or repair it.

Perry

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:hiPerry, Happy New Year, You are doing Great work on your coaling plant, It will be a show piece on your layout.

In the members personal photo section of our forum I posted some pic,s of old 4472 at Carnforth in the photo,s are some views of a coaling plant from different angles, may help your model?

regards, Derek.

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Thanks, Derek. :thumbs

I actually wangled a visit to Carnforth myself a while back and took loads of photos myself, too, so I've now got plenty or resources to consult.

..................................................

I made a thirty-mile round trip this morning to get the 'H'-channel material I need to finish the model. The model shop had a good selection of 'Evergreen' styrene strips and were only out of stock of three sizes. Guess what was included in the three? :thud

I got lucky at another shop but their prices were a good deal higher - plus I got clobbered for the extra VAT! Never mid, I now have everything I need to finish construction. :Happy

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All construction and fabrication that can be carrried out prior to final assembly has been completed.

As promised, here is a photo of the resulting 'kit':



From the left: wagon platform, rear support and hoist rails, counterweight rails, upper main assembly, pair of control cabins, pair of jigger drives, main lower assembly.

I've painted the inside of the upper main assembly and have started on the jigger drives. I'm still pondering over how much assembly to do before I apply the primer. I'm thinking I can do most of it as the primer will be applied by airbrush. That should make it fairly easy to get paint into all the areas that would be difficult to reach with a brush with less danger of damage to any of the more delicate parts.

As previously mentioned, still to build after assembly will be the remaining linking steps and handrails.

Perry


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Hello Perry,
I have followed these Posts through-out. A fantastic display of the sub-assemblies in the Final Post. Brilliant modelling, mate,
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.

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Not only have you not lost your touch Perry but I can see that your skills in the smaller details are getting better and better. Beautiful model.

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Robert wrote: Not only have you not lost your touch Perry but I can see that your skills in the smaller details are getting better and better. Beautiful model.

Thanks, Bob. :thumbs

I enjoyed my brief foray into card modelling with the Northlight Shed but really have to admit that my efforts never came anywhere near yours. I may still use card from time to time, but I guess I'm a dyed-in-the-wool plastic modeller at heart.

Perry

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Michael Thornberry wrote: Hello Perry,
I have followed these Posts through-out. A fantastic display of the sub-assemblies in the Final Post. Brilliant modelling, mate,
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.

Thanks, Michael.

Not quite the final post - I'll be putting a few more posts on this thread showing the finished assembly and then some of the painting.

Perry

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Look forward to those, Perry.

That is a grand project and you have done it justice.

A future monthly project perhaps? :lol:

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ddolfelin wrote: A future monthly project perhaps? :lol:
Can't quite see Jeff (GwentRail) wanting one of these:mutley

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I'm doing a Monthly Project in February - assuming Jeff gets his finished in time. I hope he takes his time over his current excellent task though. It would be a pity to rush it and spoil it. I don't mind if it becomes a two-month project. (I hope you're reading this, Jeff :thumbs) I can wait until March! My project will be aimed at new scratchbuilders in plastikard but won't quite be on the scale of the coaling plant! :shock:

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Stubby47 wrote: ddolfelin wrote: A future monthly project perhaps? :lol:
Can't quite see Jeff (GwentRail) wanting one of these:mutley

No problem, Stu, I can see a number of ways I could adapt Perry's build to turn it into something more suitable for my forthcoming Industrial Complex. (Just as I could see ways of "GWR-ising" his goods shed and adding Western region features to some of his other builds) ;-);-);-)


Perry wrote:
I'm doing a Monthly Project in February - assuming Jeff gets his finished in time. I hope he takes his time over his current excellent task though. It would be a pity to rush it and spoil it. I don't mind if it becomes a two-month project. (I hope you're reading this, Jeff :thumbs) I can wait until March! My project will be aimed at new scratchbuilders in plastikard but won't quite be on the scale of the coaling plant! :shock:

Perry

I'm reading it, Perry, thanks for taking the pressure off!! Alan asked me the question yesterday and I said I thought it may be mid-February before I finished - (it depends how many of the scenic subjects I cover). I hope to be finished before you start yours anyway, because I fancy joining in and learning how to scratchbuild exclam: :lol::lol::lol:

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Yeah - like you need any help, Jeff! I learned most of my stuff from YOU (plus a few others on here). :doublethumb

I took the bull by the horns this afternoon and glued up everything except the jigger drives. :Happy

I added the hoist cables before fixing the upper assembly. I took a while working out the correct order in which to put together the various sub-assemblies. This made it a lot easier to get at the parts I needed to glue up.

The construction is now complete with the exception of one set of steps, their associated handrails and one other short section of handrail. I need another couple of packets of Plastruct components to be able to finish them, so I placed an order for them this afternoon. I hope they'll arrive by the weekend so I can finish the job.  Once they're fitted, I'll take a couple more photos and post them on here.

Then I'll leave the whole thing for a few of days to let all the glue and solvent set really hard before I start the painting.

Perry

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one doe`s not realise just how many bits make up the whole ???

that is a lot of work mate , more power to your elbow..
:doublethumb:lol::lol::cool:

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How true! I remember keeping count of parts involved in the goods shed project. The total was quite scary. I haven't bothered with this project, but there is certainly a very large number of parts involved. I've really enjoyed it.

Perry

Last edited on Sat Jan 8th, 2011 07:57 am by Perry

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I would think ordering a bespoke model from Perry Engineering,  would need the sale of the family house :pedalor the youngest born exclam:

Well done Perry

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I'd happily swap my youngest born for a coal bunker but I don't think Perry would take me up on the deal.................:mutley:mutley:mutley

Can't wait to see it all assembled Perry.  From the sub-assemblies, it looks like another masterpiece.

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Thanks gents, but much as I have enjoyed building this one, I don't think I would want to do it for a living! :shock::mutley

Now that it's all assembled, I've stood it in place on the baseboard to see what it will look like, bearing in mind the earlier thoughts about the possibility of it 'overpowering' everything else due to its size. I am very pleased with how it looks. It fits in well, even as stark white as it is. Once some darker tones are painted on, I think it will recede into the scene even better.

I will photograph it next week when the remaining stairs and handrails arrive and have been fitted.

On the cost aspect, it wouldn't have been too bad at all had I not opted to use the rather expensive Plastruct components for the stairs and some of the handrails. I feel I had little choice though, because to scratchbuild that amount of stairs and handrails would have taken far too long and to get the desired consistency of appearance would have been nigh on impossible for me. The eyes and the hands struggle a bit nowadays.

So, apart from the Plastruct stuff, what did I use? Maybe a couple of sheets of 0.040" Plastikard, a few lengths of styrene strip of various sizes - mostly already in stock - some tube glue and solvent, two or three knife blades and lots of oddments from the bits box. Ignoring the cost of the Plastruct items, I doubt if the whole thing cost me much more than £20 to build. Including the Plastruct stuff would probably add another £15 or so. Having seen the cost of the quality commercially available coaling plants (£80 - £100), and not counting the card Superquick one, obviously, I think the whole cost of the project has been quite reasonable.

I started this build on 19th December 2010 and to all intents and purposes finished construction (although not the painting) on 7th January 2011, which is 20 days. Taking into account the Christmas and New Year holidays which took up some valuable modelling time, :It's a no no, I would guess that it took a little over two weeks, doing a little more on it on most days.

What have I learned from it?

1. The value of producing plans in Sketchup 8, which saved me a lot of time making the bunker assembly. I would have had to make several card mock-ups using trial and error to establish all the different angles and sizes of the parts required. Using Sketchup 8, I put in the known measurements and it worked out all the others, including the angles, for me.

2. I discovered a new (to me) way of building long lengths of handrails. Again, it was a simple little thing, but it saved me lots of time and frustration trying to get everything lined up and glued up.

3. It confirmed the value of making large models in sub-assemblies, making them easier to handle and work on, with more likelihood of easy recovery should disaster strike - which fortunately, it didn't. :thumbs

Completion photos to follow next week, then I'll do a few during painting, just in case anyone isn't completely sick of the sight of it yet. :pedal

Perry

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Perry wrote:  just in case anyone isn't completely sick of the sight of it yet.
You've got to be kidding Perry, this has been so educational. :thumbs

I'm building a station from scratch thanks to you and your explanations and I'm loving it. My problem is that I cant just nip out and get the materials; I have to send for them therefore the whole project can come to a full stop for weeks. Could I therefore ask, do you source all your plastic from local shops or is it just as well to get it from suppliers like Squires?

Your craftsmanship and artistry are outstanding and I've got a lot out of this thread Perry, many thanks.

Les


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Good point Les - I'm in the same boat and, to make shipping costs easier on the wallet, I try to bulk up orders which puts even more strain on the budget.

A certain shop in Cornwall is very helpful in that they'll ship stuff here for a flat rate of £5 providing you keep the weight down (can't remember what the actual weight limit is but I'm sure the Boss of that shop will remind us .......Chris - are you there ?)

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Thanks for the kind comments.

I get my materials from a variety of sources, using 'local' shops and mail order. Unfortunately, my 'local' model shops are still a thirty-mile round trip away, so I can't exactly just nip down to the shop when I run out of anything.

I order Plastruct from a source that is in my County, but a fair way away. They charge postage and packing at a reasonable rate and I've calculated that it's still cheaper then spending money on fuel to drive there and back.

I have two or three 'local' sources of 'Evergreen' styrene products, but they are often out of stock of the ones I want. I like their plastikard, though. It has a nice surface on both sides, but it isn't cheap. I have bought packs of 10 or so sheets of Plastikard from other sources but have found that the quality and finish varies. One batch I bought was very shiny on one side and needed sanding to take paint well.

Over a long period of time I have gradually amassed a good selection of packets of microstrip and rod, and have found that they last quite well, so most of the stuff I need is usually already to hand. I keep almost all my offcuts of sheet and strip too, and find them very useful and economical to use.

Perry

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I find that Squires for Plasticard and similar products works out slightly cheaper when the postage is taken into account (Orders over £10 they don't charge for UK postage).
Also, the delivery is very good.
Unlike some suppliers.

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Petermac wrote: Good point Les - I'm in the same boat and, to make shipping costs easier on the wallet, I try to bulk up orders which puts even more strain on the budget.

A certain shop in Cornwall is very helpful in that they'll ship stuff here for a flat rate of £5 providing you keep the weight down (can't remember what the actual weight limit is but I'm sure the Boss of that shop will remind us .......Chris - are you there ?)

You probably find like me Peter that you only realise you need a few strips of "x" by "y" microstrip half way through the build so unless you have the perspicacity of a soothesayer you wont realise it for your bulk order until it's too late. Maybe you and I should start a continental shop.

I must follow this thing up from Ol Blue Eyes cos I didn't know about it (but I'm not going on a diet just to keep postage costs down).:roll:

Sorry to be a pain Perry but are you able to let us know what your most commonly used sizes of microstrip are?

Les

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Les wrote: ............Sorry to be a pain Perry but are you able to let us know what your most commonly used sizes of microstrip are?

Les

Not a pain at all. That's the whole idea of this forum - to be able ask anything.

It's not an easy question to answer, because it depends on the task in hand,  but I'll give it a go.

0.020" x 0.020" (0.5mm x 0.5mm)
0.040" x 0.040" (1mm x 1mm)
0.040" x 0.080" (1mm x 2mm)
0.080" x 0.100" (2mm x 2.5mm)
0.188" x 0.188" (4.8mm x 4.8mm)

I have just checked my stock and I actually have 14 different sizes of strip, plus a small selection of rod, tube, box section and girder section material, but I find I don't use much of these. A lot of 'H' or 'I'-section girders are built from sheet and/or microstrip as long as I don't need huge lengths of them, in which case I buy them ready-made, as in the main hoist support rails on this project.

I also keep a stock of  0.005", 0.010", 0.020" and 0.040" styrene sheets, with the emphasis on 0.040" (1mm). I use this for most of my main construction work. I can always laminate these if I need anything thicker, but I find 0.040" an ideal thickness to work with generally.

I hope this helps.

Perry



Last edited on Sat Jan 8th, 2011 12:15 pm by Perry

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That's great Perry. I only have a supply of numbers 2 and 3 on the list so I know what to aim at now. Many thanks.:thumbs

Les

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I assume you've found the extra cost of the Evergreen stuff is worth it Perry.  They don't seem to know what it is over here but then it could be that I'm asking for dustbins or something !!  Anyone know what the French for "plasticard" is ?

I'd always understood that all plasticard had a rough and smooth face - the smooth for glueing and the rough for painting.   It appears I've learnt something else today .......:roll::roll::roll:

Your list of stock is indeed useful and yes Les, you're right about when I find out I'm short of something ............

I searched the whole of Yorkshire for some Evergeen rod a couple of years ago and found an excellent stockist at Wakefield Model & Craft Centre.  His upper floor is an Aladin's Cave for railway modellers. :thumbs  They don't appear to have a dedicated web site but if you Google it, there are loads of links to it plus an online shop.

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I like the quality of the Evergreen card. To my eyes, it looks to be the same finish, or as near as dammit, on both sides. Some of the cheaper stuff I tried (can't recall where from) was almost a mirror finish on one side and wasn't anywhere near as nice to work with, IMHO. I've also found that the Evergreen stuff is a little more rigid than some other brands.

As I don't use huge quantities of it, even on a project of this size, I'm happy to pay the extra. Giving some consideration to how a sheet is marked out prior to cutting can often save a lot of waste. I try to make the most of each sheet and try to ensure that the offcuts are of a useable size but even the smaller pieces go in the bits box. I use them to make reinforcing fillets, small brackets and the like. Not much gets wasted.

Perry

Last edited on Sat Jan 8th, 2011 04:13 pm by Perry

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Les wrote: .........I'm building a station from scratch thanks to you and your explanations and I'm loving it. .......................
Les



New thread with photos coming up, I hope????? :doublethumb

Perry

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Oh blimey. :oops: Well I hadn't intended that really Perry. I was more sort of letting it sneak through on my personal layouts thread Devon Junction. There is a picture there you could see.:lol::lol::lol::lol::roll:

Les

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Les wrote: Oh blimey. :oops: Well I hadn't intended that really Perry. I was more sort of letting it sneak through on my personal layouts thread Devon Junction. There is a picture there you could see.:lol::lol::lol::lol::roll:

Les

I just had a look and I fear there's absolutely no chance of "letting it sneak through"! :mutley

This is a pretty major scratchbuild and we want, nay, we DEMAND more photos and "How-to's"! So come on, Les, a new scratchbuilding thread is required of you at this juncture! :doublethumb

Us 'Scratchies' have got to stick together. :thumbs

Perry

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I agree bring on the piccies,:mutley

Perry said:- Us 'Scratchies' have got to stick together. :thumbs
would that involve m e k or super glue, or just the stuff that sticks to woolly blankets ????

:pedal:mutley:mutley:lol::cool:

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I suppose I'm lucky to have a model shop just 1 mile from my house and another 4 in Cardiff, which is just 12 miles away. Even so, the biggest problem, caused by a shop's need to order significant quantities, seems to be finding the specific size you need is out of stock pending the next delivery.

I currently have in stock various sizes of strip, L section, U section, H beams, and rod, as well as at least 1 sheet of all thicknesses from 10 thou (0.10") to 80 thou, with 20, 40 & 60 being the most common. So I tend to stock up using Squires, adding on a few bits to any order I place.

Perry's list gives a good basis for keeping "handy bits" in stock and to that end I published a table of some uses in an earler version of the forum. As that appears to have been lost during the "big crash" several years ago, here's a copy for your use  that includes Squires references. The prices will not be accurate though :roll::roll: :-



I have a more comprehensive list somewhere, but can't find it at the moment.


 

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Where did you buy the "kit" from Perry ?:shock::shock::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:

Another masterpiece i think i shall hang up me modelling tweezers and take up fishing!

Can't wait to see it in situ.

Last edited on Mon Jan 10th, 2011 07:52 pm by wogga

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wogga wrote: Where did you buy the "kit" from Perry ?:shock::shock::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen::mrgreen:

Another masterpiece i think i shall hang up me modelling tweezers and take up fishing!

Can't wait to see it in situ.

:mutley:mutley:mutley

Please don't even consider hanging up your tweezers! This build, like the others I have done, wasn't difficult. It just takes a bit of time and preparation. If you can stick a few pieces of plastikard together, you can build pretty much anything you want.

It may seem a strange sequence of events, but the 'situ' in which this is going to sit isn't built yet. I wasn't sure exactly what the track spacing for the two roads was going to be, although I had a rough idea, so I decided to construct most my buildings before I get around to laying the track to suit. I know it's ar*e about face to build the 'scenery' before the trackwork, but as the buildings are intended to be such a major feature of my layout, I want to be sure they will fit properly. It also give me a chance to do a 'Phill'; move a structure "a couple of millimetres to the left" :mutley if it would look better.

Perry

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The staircase and handrail parts I was waiting for arrived this morning so I was finally able to complete the construction of this model. The only things not glued in place now are the jigger drives. They will be added after all the other painting is done.

So folks, here is a series of photos showing the completed structure from pretty much every angle. It's so different from each aspect that I thought it was worth photographing from each side. I hope you don't find it all a bit much. :oops:



















That's all until the painting! :thumbs

Perry





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My gob is once again suitably smacked Perry.

It looks absoluitely terriffic :pathead

With lots of intricate looking machinery to examine, it really does look the bees knees and to hell with what it may or may not have cost, presumably you've enjoyed building it, we've certainly enjoyed watching you build it and, once it's in place on your layout, you'll know there isn't another like it on the globe.  A very impressive model Sir. :cheers

Another masterpiece from our master scratchbuilder.  You could almost start your own masterclasses with what you've done so far on this forum. :thumbs:thumbs:thumbs

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That really is terrific, Perry.  I know how much work went into it.  Sorry; but I have to say it.

Tick VG Elephant stamp.   :thumbs

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That's fantastic Perry  :doublethumb  :doublethumb

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Brilliant.

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Wot that lot said, i am gobsmacked at the skill you have.

phill

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The last photo is the most impressive one - it's only then you realise how BIG this thing is ...

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An excellent result Perry . Very well done.:thumbs

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Thank you all for your kind comments. :oops::oops:

It is, when all is said and done, just a styrene box with a few bits and pieces stuck on it.

There is absolutely no reason why anyone who can cut a piece of plastikard can't build something like this. I admit it looks complicated, but by building it one piece at a time, then making those pieces into sub-assemblies before finally joining them all together means that it really wasn't difficult at all.

The only things you need apart from your usual modelling tools and materials are patience and the determination. The folk on here generally have patience in abundance, otherwise they wouldn't be modellers. The second is taken care of by the encouragement and help that is always forthcoming on this forum.

I recall a while ago several members worrying about dipping their toes into the scratchbuilding world for the first time, but there are now many threads on here that bear testament to their achievements. As I usually say at the end of one of my projects, if this has encouraged even one more person to try scratchbuilding, then I am very happy with the result.

Cheers guys! :cheers

:doublethumb

Perry

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Ditto, ditto, ditto & ditto and you are too modest Perry a pleasure to watch, when are you starting the station i need some inspiration :thumbs:thumbs:thumbs

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Perry,
I just tuned in to the end of this thread and that kit looks great!

What brand is it?

Do they supply decals with it?

Wayne :mutley

PS: I'm Impressed!

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suitably impressed and inspired, a great build.

:doublethumb:lol::cool:

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That is one crackin' looking model. It will have a certain presence in your MPD. Now get it suitably mucky!

Cheers
Dave

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:doublethumbSuperb Job Perry. With a lash of soot and grime and joined by your Ash-Plant build you will have a great atmosphere of the real thing on your MPD. Not to forget that great Northlight shed in card :thumbs In one of your photo,s of the ash-plant ? there was a great looking water tower supported by some impressive metal work. maybe a nice add on? :lol:

regards,

Derek

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shunter1 wrote: :doublethumbSuperb Job Perry. With a lash of soot and grime and joined by your Ash-Plant build you will have a great atmosphere of the real thing on your MPD. Not to forget that great Northlight shed in card :thumbs In one of your photo,s of the ash-plant ? there was a great looking water tower supported by some impressive metal work. maybe a nice add on? :lol:

regards,

Derek

Thanks, Derek.

I know the water tower you speak of. It's the one at Carnforth. However, I have already built a water-softening plant which incorporates a water tower, so the current plan is to use that. The build, part scratched, part kit-bashed, is here:

http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=1444&forum_id=14

I'm planning to rebuild the steps and handrails though. :oops:

Perry

Last edited on Sun Jan 16th, 2011 06:21 pm by Perry

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When I first masked the windows ready for priming, I used masking tape that covered the whole window area. This was less than satisfactory but enabled me to get a couple of quick coats of primer on. I have now removed the masking tape and masked the window transparencies with small pieces of 'Post-It' note paper. The adhesive strip on these are just enough to keep it in place. It is thin enough and pliable enough to be able to fit into the window recess so that just the tranparency is covered.

There are a few more areas that need priming, including the  underside of the main hopper, so I'll blow some primer around the windows when I have the airbrush set up for that job.

I have to admit being pleased with how smart the model looks in a nice even coat of grey primer. It's almost a pity to try to make it look worn and filthy! ;-)

Perry

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Pictures Perry - pictures !!!!!

When you masked the windows, was there any risk of the pressure in applying the tape (or Post-Its) popping the glazing material off ?

I did just that once and couldn't access the building to retrieve panel ........:twisted::twisted::twisted::twisted::twisted:  Obviously my "sparing" appication of glue was too sparing !!

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Petermac wrote: Pictures Perry - pictures !!!!!

When you masked the windows, was there any risk of the pressure in applying the tape (or Post-Its) popping the glazing material off ?

I did just that once and couldn't access the building to retrieve panel ........:twisted::twisted::twisted::twisted::twisted:  Obviously my "sparing" appication of glue was too sparing !!

I considered posting pictures of the this model and the others in primer, but the grey is so pale that is doesn't really show up much different to raw plastikard on camera.

When I applied that masking tape, there was no risk of damage to the windows, because I applied it across the window opening, not actually onto the transparency. The 'Post-It' masks are much less sticky and lighter altogther, so I 'persuaded' them into place on the transparecncy with a very light touch, being mindful of exactly the problem you had. So far, all is well. I don't think blowing a thin coat or two of paint around them will make them stick too much, and pulling them away shouldn't dislodge anything. It would be inward pressure on the window that could possibly cause damage.

The next photos will probably be when I get the base coat applied. This is going to be Vallejo 70990  'Light Grey'. Light grey it may be, but it's still a good deal darker than the primer. The primer is so pale that it's not far off white. The Light Grey should form a fairly good base to build up with other shades and colours to represent concrete.

Vallejo do three primers; Grey, Black and White. Black would be an absolute pig to paint anything else over, in my humble opinion. White doesn't show up very well at all on white Plastikard, so my only other option was the grey, but even that is a little pale for me.

Perry

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It would seem you've taken to Vallejo paints.

I'll be interested in seeing how you like it.

For my next painting project, I'm going to try the Jo Sonja range of acrylics.  I'm sure there's a big difference in the characteristics of paints from the various manufacturers.  You just have to experiment to find the one that works for you.

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It's my first foray into using acrylics for model painting.

The main reason for changing to acrylics from enamels is the fact that they are water based, making thinning paint and cleaning up a lot easier. SWMBO doesn't like the odour given off by enamel paint or white spirit/thinners, so in the interests of domestic harmony I decided to try an alternative.

The main reason I have initially opted for Vallejo products was simply that at least two or three model shops locally (within a 30-mile round trip) stock them, although prices vary quite a lot. For example, two stockists less than a couple of hundred yards apart charge £1.99 and £2.20 respectively for exactly the same product. :shock:  I still tend to think back to 'old money' when making price comparisons, and that's more than four shillings difference. That's outrageous! Guess which stockist I choose?!

I'm finding it tricky to get the amount of dilution right for brush painting and feel that maybe this product is perhaps better suited to airbrushing. The Vallejo 'Model Air' range, formulated especially for airbrushes, doesn't seem to be available in the shops in my neck of the woods, so I have little option but to thin my own using the 'Model Color' range of paints.



My painting table - with the coaling stage precariously up-ended for priming. :shock:

Perry

Last edited on Wed Jan 26th, 2011 11:13 am by Perry

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Looking at that setup Perry, do you think a turntable is an essential ?

Also, it looks as if you don't get much overspray (drift) as you only seem to have a dustsheet over SWMBO's Parker-Knoll (or is it Chippendale). The coffee tables seem quite oblivious .......................

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The turntable is not essential by any means, but I find it reduces the temptation for me to grab the model when the paint is wet to turn it to a better angle for spraying. I can gently rotate it even whilst the paint is being applied.  I can turn the model easily to check it from a multitude of viewpoints as I work. I do have a tendency to stick my fingers onto wet paint otherwise! :oops:

The covers on the furniture are purely there to reduce fading in the sunshine - not that we're getting too much of that at present. :sad: I haven't found overspray too much of a problem. There's very little on the paper covering the table, and most of what is there is from me doing little 'test sprays' before pointing the airbrush at the model. So most of the paint I got on the paper was intentional.

It surprised me how little paint I actually used. As most of it is on the model (or on the paper!) I doubt if much is wasted in overspray. Certainly I haven't been able to see it on the furniture - thank goodness. :shock:

There's only 60ml of primer in one of those bottles when full. That's about 12 teaspoonfuls. I have done a fair amount of brush painting - which uses a lot more paint - and several coats have been airbrushed onto the models shown on the table - and I estimate the bottle is still 1/4 to 1/3 full. It's being used undiluted; straight from the bottle.

Perry

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The coaling plant got it's first coat of pale grey acrylic today. I purposely put it on rather unevenly, because the finished article will not have a 'clean' finish.

I'm going to need to do a couple of coats, especially as I need to turn the whole thing upside down to paint the underside of the discharge chutes and hoppers.

Once they are done, I can start making it look suitably 'mucky'! :thumbs

Perry

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'Dirtying up' started this morning. I've tried to make the grime thicker and more extensive the lower down the structure you go, as this would seem logical. I've darkened the area where the truck-loads of coal would have deposited dust and muck as they were being hoisted to and from the hoppers. I've also taken into account where the smoke from locos using the plant would deposit soot from their chimneys and darkened these areas accordingly.

I'm used Vallejo 'Grey Black' as a starting point. Pure black is far too strong and I find this colour very useful for anything affected by coal-dust and smoke.

Having completed this first session, I'm concious of not wanting to overdo the effect, so I'll let the paint dry thoroughly before I do any more. These acrylic colours appear to become slightly lighter as they dry.

Some parts of the model are going to be hand-brush painted after the airbrush work is done.

I'll try to put a photograph of my progress on this thread later today.

Perry

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I finished the airbrushing and did some detail work with a hand-brush this afternoon.

The only thing not done now is the permanent fixing of the jigger drives in place.





So here is the finished model - well, finished as far as I will take it for now. I may notice areas where a dab or two of paint are needed as time goes on, but I can touch them in as and when I'm ready.

I've posed a 9F on the coaling road and an Ivatt 4MT about to remove a lonely 16T empty coal wagon from the hoist platform just to give a sense of scale.

So, I think I'll call it a day on this little scratchbuild. I'm reasonably happy with the way it turned out. It has been built and painted over a period of about 6 weeks, give or take a few days. Allowing for Christmas and the New Year holidays with all the usual family commitments, and the fact that I had two other scratchbuilds and a modification project in progress at the same time, I don't think it's taken too long at all. I hope you'll agree that it looks the part. It should become a nice feature on the layout in due course.

I'd like to think that this project might have encouraged someone else on here to have a go at building something similar. Yes, it is quite big, but it also very simple; just a series of plastikard boxes stuck to each other, with a few twiddly bits added here and there for effect. Seriously, it isn't complicated or difficult. What it is, is unique. No-one else in the world has one identical to it, and that's what I like about scratchbuilding - making a unique one-off model of something I really like. There's nothing wrong with the Superquick model or any of the other (somewhat expensive) proprietory makes, but to me they are all recognisable as off-the-shelf models, and lots of other folk have identical ones on their layouts. This may not matter to you. However, if it does, you will get a great kick and great satisfaction out of scratchbuilding.

Go on. Have a go. You know you want to.:cool wink

Perry



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Well Perry i am totally speechless,your sparing use of the airbrush tops it off...superb and well done sir!

Regards

Pete

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Hello Perry,
Wow!!! I'm speechless :shock::lol: , well, almost. An absolutely stunning paint-finish. I knew it would look-good, but not this good. A fantastic combination of scratch-modelling and painting/weathering. What an achievement, mate, :doublethumb
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.

Last edited on Sun Jan 30th, 2011 05:59 pm by

Perry
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Thanks, guys! :oops: Glad you like it.

I have seen photos of the prototypes in books and on the internet, so that gave me a guide to how the general appearance needed to be. I photographed the one at Carnforth myself, but that has now stood so long in clean air that it has a faint covering of yellowish lichen and didn't look 'right' for the steam era. I'm guessing that a lot of the old soot and grime has weathered away too, so relying on black and white photos was the best I could do.

Some of the more subtle weathering and detail painting doesn't really show up on my photos, but the overall appearance on the layout is OK.

I can always adjust the colouring and weathering a little later if I need to. That's the beauty of using the airbrush; it makes subtle changes easy to do.

Perry

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Perry it has the WOW factor,and so it should and as you say it is a one off,  :doublethumb

now about this sticking boxes together? mmmmm, ok easy??
it`s the fiddly bits that are the booby trap,!!!
:mutley:mutley:lol::cool:


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owen69 wrote: Perry it has the WOW factor,and so it should and as you say it is a one off,  :doublethumb

now about this sticking boxes together? mmmmm, ok easy??
it`s the fiddly bits that are the booby trap,!!!
:mutley:mutley:lol::cool:



:mutley:mutley

There are no booby traps, honestly, Owen. :It's a no no

The only slightly fiddly bits were the scratchbuilt handrails and the counterweight rails. Most of the handrails, and all the steps, were purchased ready-made.

As I said before, it looks complicated, but it isn't. There's just quite a lot of it!

Perry

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Absolutely superb, Perry.  Stunning, even.  I must admit I had my doubts with the sheer size of the thing, but it will be a centre piece because it's so well done.  Tick, VG  and the obligatory elephant stamp.  :thumbs

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:thumbsThat is one cracker of a build Perry, Captures the real thing to a Tee. You are going to have a superb MPD layout and rightly so after all the skill and effort you are putting into the models!

Enjoy the Loco roster when you are up and running.

regards,

Derek

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Perry wrote:Go on. Have a go. You know you want to.
Perry


If I recall correctly that is the exact same line that got me into scratch building. :Red Card

So watch out everyone ........... but he's right about one thing, you do get great satisfaction from scratch building.

I enjoy it immensely!

Great job Perry! You are an inspiration to us all!

Wayne

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Wayne Williams wrote: Perry wrote:Go on. Have a go. You know you want to.
Perry


If I recall correctly that is the exact same line that got me into scratch building. :Red Card

So watch out everyone ........... but he's right about one thing, you do get great satisfaction from scratch building.

I enjoy it immensely!

Great job Perry! You are an inspiration to us all!

Wayne

Thanks all for the kind comments. :oops:

I do recall saying something like that before, Wayne. :roll:  I also remember your first faltering steps in scratchbuilding - but look at what you're achieving now! :thumbs I'm really pleased to have perhaps contributed in some small way to encouraging others to 'have a go'.
As you seem to have found, it becomes somewhat addictive; an itch you just have to scratch - if you'll pardon the pun. :mutley

Each time a scratchbuilder builds something, he (or she) hopes for a little improvement in the outcome as he (or she) strives for the unattainable perfect result.

I've got rid of my 'itch' for now, but I don't think it will be long before I get the urge to start another project. After all, I still need a loco workshop, a diesel refuelling bay, a diesel shed, and..and..and................:hmm

Perry


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What a fantastic job you have made of that Perry. it really looks superb.  I have really enjoyed following the progress of this, and your other, builds.  :thumbs:thumbs:thumbs

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Big, ugly and dirty. Exactly what's needed. Crackin' model Perry.

Cheers
Dave

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Perry,
I know what you mean by "getting rid of the itch". I have hit a plato on the Old Republic. After some 100 plus hours on the cupola I needed a rest.

But that's what is so interesting with this hobby, when you tire of one thing, there are so many other ones to go to and, bingo, you are off and running again.

Wayne

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ElDavo wrote: Big, ugly and dirty. Exactly what's needed. Crackin' model Perry.

Cheers
Dave

"Big, ugly and dirty", is that me, or the model? :mutley:mutley:mutley

Thanks, Dave.

Perry

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Janner wrote: What a fantastic job you have made of that Perry. it really looks superb.  I have really enjoyed following the progress of this, and your other, builds.  :thumbs:thumbs:thumbs

Thanks, John.

Glad you enjoyed it. :thumbs

Perry

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Wayne Williams wrote: Perry,
I know what you mean by "getting rid of the itch". I have hit a plato on the Old Republic. After some 100 plus hours on the cupola I needed a rest.

But that's what is so interesting with this hobby, when you tire of one thing, there are so many other ones to go to and, bingo, you are off and running again.

Wayne

That's one half of the problem, Wayne. The other half is having so many jobs you want to do, you don't know where to start! :shock:

I think you've earned a rest from the Old Republic, but please make it a short one. We're all 'itching' to see how it turns out. :thumbs

Perry


                 

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