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Sol
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During previous versions, I had thought of doing a reasonably major change to the main station of Tawnton by reducing the width of the baseboard from 39 back to 33 inches but did not do it as I was happy with the track plan.

Well ,over the last couple of operating sesssions, in the difficulty of actually shunting  such a long station & complex movements & coupled with trying to reach to do scenery, etc, some changes are looming.

The next 3 photos show the  corners & the main area.



Requiring a reach of 48 inches.

 




a reach of 43 inches & the next one of the main is 39 inches




Discussed this with my mate Robbo ( ex UK signal man) & the current concept of a large station will go & be replaced with two smaller terminal stations. Continous running still to be used - in fact the main dead end storage will be first modified with a couple of tracks made continous. Careful planning will see this evolve so that operations can still be carried out.

One thing that will happen is that long passenger trains of 7 coaches will reduce to 5 & from 3 trains back to 2.


 

Marty
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So... out with the axe?

MikeC
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Hmmm I had wondered why you hadn't landscaped that corner :mutley

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Sol
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I was working my way to that corner & that is one reason I really stopped to think about it. Max saw it all today.
The Axe will be used in part.

Last edited on Tue Nov 2nd, 2010 05:02 am by

MaxSouthOz
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I'm saying nothing.  :roll:

Sol
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After an operating session here today with the gang & discussing the planned changes, it has been decided ( & I must admit I am happy with it - a lot cheaper) - NOT to demolish Tawnton but get stuck into & build the centre peninsular as double decks. The shunting problems can be sorted by re-arranging the card system. Reaching to do scenery is, really, a once off effort & the trackage currently behind Tawnton will be hidden by a backboard of at least 12" high so low relief buildings can be used.

Some of the existing storage tracks will be made through running to assist in operations.

Marty
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Phew!

Now... just relax your grip, easy does it, there... I'll go and put the axe away in the cupboard for a bit then!

In Hobart, Tasmania, there is a big shed filled with an O gauge alpine railway. Can't remember what it's called or where it is exactly.... and I mean filled, an old packing shed or factory unit or somesuch, 4m ceiling to floor mountain scenery.
They had a workmans plank suspended from the ceiling on a pulley and track system so that they could build the scenery from above!
Something to consider maybe? hehehe

MaxSouthOz
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Marty exclam:  :Red Card   You know what he's like.  Don't encourage him.

henryparrot
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Now if you take up Martys suggestion Ron we dp want phoyos of you suspended from the plank:lol::lol:

brian

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Just for consideration, Ron:
There is a ladder system meant for use on stairs.
I don't see why it couldn't be used to span your layout.
They are lightweight and not very expensive.
Just a thought.

http://www.diytools.co.uk/diy/Main/sp-2-1800-928-titan-aluminium-3-way-ladder.asp?iCategoryID1=1800

Last edited on Wed Nov 3rd, 2010 08:33 am by ddolfelin

Sol
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Or one of these
http://www.micromark.com/TOPSIDE-CREEPER-STEP-LADDER-SUPPORT-SYSTEM,8854.html

I will work something out.

Gwiwer
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Well the never-ending saga of the Devan & Summersett takes yet another fascinating turn.

What ever the outcome I am sure it will give you and the regular operators lots of pleasure. Not to mention the challenges of building it up as you wish.

Watching with interest here.

sparky
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That guy on the topside creeper could have reached the part he wanted to from standing on the floor in front of the layout?

 Ron what are those small objects lining the front of your baseboards ? are they to do with points?

Sol
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Yes Reg, point operating switches, post #46 on http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=1733&forum_id=6&page=3

sparky
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Ah right . Thanks Ron i had forgotten that those were there .:oops:

Sol
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Even though the major change of ripping up Tawnton has been shelved. some of the other changes has started.

It was planned to alter 3 dead end storage sidings to through running & this needed some additional pointwork & where the first point to come off the mainline that runs through the "sceniced " part of Barnstable - I had some fun.

The first photo has two holes for the Tortoise ( surplus ex Max's turtle farm) to be able to conmnect into the tiebar. The first hole with the blue cross I thought was well clear of any underneath woodwork but Murphy dictated - "NO WAY" so that is the reason for the second hole.




The next shot has the first hole covered, point in temporary position with the wire rod to be moved by a Turtle ( when it is released from the Farm)




All fitted now - it was fun connecting Code 83 to Code 100 each end, flattened Code 100 metal fishplates & soldered to both rails - works like a dream !!l  Getting the angles/alignment was fun considering it is 32 "/ 80 cm  in from the baseboard edge.




The next two photos show the new points where they will be installed to make the 3 dead end into through running - coaches are on the outer two tracks. These will use above mounted Peco motors.







 

Got the timber today for the centre peninsula - 3.3m x 0.4 m ( 10'10"  x 1'4") - two levels - 6 track storage under & a station on top - a couple of my "mates" reckon it should all be done by next weekend exclam: December maybe .

Last edited on Fri Nov 5th, 2010 01:32 am by

Gwiwer
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two holes for the Tortoise ( surplus ex Max's turtle farm)

They are entirely different species, Sol, and should not be confused! :mutley

Sol
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Gwiwer wrote: two holes for the Tortoise ( surplus ex Max's turtle farm)

They are entirely different species, Sol, and should not be confused! :mutley


Sorry Rick, I was stepping on Petermac's shoes.

 

Re Tortoise v Turtle - I don't care what species as  long as they move the point tiebar when given a touch of electricity ( as their food) ;-)

Marty
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Looking forward to seeing the Peninsula develop. :thumbs keep it coming.

phill
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Looking forward to seeing what you have in mind. Shall we say Sat this week for pics of the finnish place :twisted::mutley

Phill

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Are you sure you know what you're doing, Sol?  That looks like a very big hole.  :shock:

 

Sol
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MaxSouthOz wrote: Are you sure you know what you're doing, Sol?  That looks like a very big hole.  :shock:

 

Time will tell once I get it motorised late Nov/early Dec.   Anyway, gaping holes on the ground is the going thing now. ;-)

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Among my kit I have a large stock of holes, Ron.
Just let me have the dimensions next time and I'll send it Airmail.

Sol
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I am glad your signature DD, has this warning ...

Warning: Some posts may contain humour

**********************************************

Please send me an assortment of holes, those not suitable will be returned.

ddolfelin
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I won't send any large holes because of the weight.

I have some very nice black holes (including the Studio at the moment where I had sudden instructions to clear the kitchen table).

Michael Thornberry
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Hello Ron and DD,
Do these holes, of varying dimensions, come with "sky-hooks" attached to help retain said holes in-situ and is there a recommended number of "sky-hooks" per hole and are the "sky-hooks" re-usable after the holes are filled-in? Just asking,
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.
PS:- Do these "sky-hooks" also vary, in size, dependant on hole-size?:lol:

Last edited on Sat Nov 6th, 2010 01:49 am by

Gwiwer
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Remember that sky-hooks must be attached to the holes using a left-handed screwdriver.

Sol
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All 3 points now in situ - last two with side-mounted Peco motors & microswitch for frog switching ( microswitch will be covered ), Tortoise still to be installed when I get it Nov 28.

Wiring now back to panel which will need some mods. ( splitting time between this & centre peninsula)




 

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I assume all your points are electrofrog Ron

The microswitch you are using is that a standard one bought from an eletronic bits supplier?

Brian

Sol
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henryparrot wrote: I assume all your points are electrofrog Ron   Yes

The microswitch you are using is that a standard one bought from an eletronic bits supplier?  like this one
http://www.jaycar.com.au/productView.asp?ID=SM1036

Brian

I am using live frog as I connect a LED across it to indicate track selected is powered as mentioned in other posts of mine. 

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Ron,

In your last post you indicated

I am using live frog as I connect a LED across it to indicate track selected is powered as mentioned in other posts of mine.

Do you have a post link for this and have you included a wiring diagram

 

 

Sol
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Connor, see post #4 of http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=7210&forum_id=6

Last edited on Tue Nov 9th, 2010 08:31 pm by

Sol
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Back on previous posts in various threads of my layout, I had shown this junction at one end of Tawnton.



Four points, one single slip & two 3-way and  are operated via slide switches




Because these points are not easily seen in how they are set, I added some LEDs into the tracks but they still cause confusion especially the two 3-way points for the operators who only work on the layout fortnightly ( OK for me coz I use them, most days) so after another Op session today, it does seem that I will have to motorise the points & provide an additional panel with push buttons with LEDs in the panel instead of in the tracks.

Two points - hand made , will need to be replaced with Peco to provide tiebar locking.

In fact some simplification is possible.

 

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Sol wrote: ... Two points - hand made , will need to be replaced with Peco to provide tiebar locking. ...

Sounds a bit drastic Ron.  Couldn't you use SEEP PM4 solenoids or Tortoise/Cobalt/Fulgarex/Lemarco motors that self latch?

Cheers
Dave

Sol
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Dave, not keen on solenoids on tiebars that have blades soldered. Some of the Peco points already have solenoids operated via Masterswitch units & the possible new small panel with push buttons, will diode matrix some like the 3 way units. I could fit Tortoise/Cobalt as those points that maybe replaced as they had been operated by Tortoise before when the entire station was panel controlled but when I converted to location control in front of the points, Tortoises removed & sold.

John Flann
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Just a thought Ron, to reach into my hidden three track staging yard and over a 8" high backscene (I'm about 5'9') I have a small raised step out of 2"x4"s and this makes it more comfortable. The base board at that point is about 19"

The furthest reach into my corners is about 28"and that's far enough.

Sol
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Yes John, the main operator for those points is also a few inches shorter than me but even the other taller operators have difficulty in determining point setting. It will get sorted.

John Flann
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Ron, I too have a three way point in my new fiddle yard and to which there is good access, but I find it difficult sometimes to determine just what road is set. Some form of indication on the viewing side would be useful. I'm thinking a simple line diagram would do the job.

Sol
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Post #33 showed the main station throat at Tawnton & the planned modifications.


Started now, replaced two hand made units with Peco & motorised them. Removed one point where the tanker is sitting & made the single slip into a conventional point - pinned one set of blades across & the modified slip now works in parallel with the entry point also now motorised.  Couple more motors & a panel ( which is half built to go.

The DMU tracks will be moved further apart to allow for a fuelling platform similar to what I have seen on another forum / Bachmann unit  http://www.ehattons.com/StockDetail.aspx?SID=24629




Sol
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The station throat now fully motorised using Peco side mounted solenoids




I was going to operate using pushbuttons & diode matrix but had the problem of frog switching for the two  3- way points so I use Masterswitch V1 units which provide a  pulse of power but are activated via a toggle switch so the other half of the toggle does the frog switching. This is the panel




The LEDs are connected across the track & DCC power is used. Point 28 is operated as a crossover with 32 so only one switch required as  28 has a dead frog.

Back to an operating session next week.

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looks good ,enjoy your operating session
:doublethumb:lol::lol::cool:

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Looking good Sol
I like the small local panel idea

Chris

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Ron, it all looks most professional and must be fascinating to operate. A heck of a lot of work, and thinking, is going into this.

Sol
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Yes John, I am into the operational side more than scenery/prototype aspects. I will get a photo of the Command Centre a bit later.

Sol
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The Command centre where the Train Contoller sits - he can not only set all points for storage sidings but all the junction points & the main throat at Tawnton.




This shot also shows where the train orders are retained - on the end of the centre peninsula.






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The layout looks great Ron.

Can you explain what the green metal bars that go over the storage sidings are for? Apologies if you have covered this elsewhere. Also I have been thinking of using some of those side mounted Peco point motors for some areas of my layout. I would be interested to know how you are getting on with them. They look quite neat in position and will be even better once the ballasting is in and they are weathered.

Bob

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Looking very neat Ron. Your panels are first class!

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:hiRon, I am very impressed  by your electrical skills and control designs and of course your Railway layout.

Looks like you will have loads of fun and interest in the coming years as you continue the build.

Regards,

Derek

Sol
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Novice wrote: Can you explain what the green metal bars that go over the storage sidings are for? Apologies if you have covered this elsewhere.   Bob http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=7607&forum_id=52&page=4  Post #70 onwards Also I have been thinking of using some of those side mounted Peco point motors for some areas of my layout. I would be interested to know how you are getting on with them. They look quite neat in position and will be even better once the ballasting is in and they are weathered. Yes they are neat & Rick/Gwiwer also uses them. They do take a bit of just getting them right mainly in levels . Itis a pity they don't come with a changeover switch built in.

Bob

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Nice tidy workmanship on the control station Sol.

I am very happy with my Peco side motors. They are easy to fit, reliable, can be blended into the running scene as point motors (see my own layout thread) and if necessary can be replaced in just 5 minutes with next to no effort. That's between trains for some of us rather than between sessions.

They don't like being misaligned so it pays to get them perfectly level and with the throw at exactly 90 degrees where at all possible - though they will work equally well on Y and 3-way points where they have to lie alongside curved track and throw at an obtuse angle.

Last edited on Wed Feb 23rd, 2011 12:04 pm by

John Flann
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Ron, how I'd like the space you have, its very interesting and impressive to see and the standard of workmanship. Plus I'm sure a lot of pleasure to operate.

Please also see my posting today on John Dew's thread about a 9" grid, I meant to make it earlier here when you were track laying.

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Ron
Thanks for the explanation and link to your other thread - now I understand! I am now going to use the side mounted Peco point motors for my MPD, which has tracks running underneath it which prevent under baseboard mounting of the motors.

Bob

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After a recent op session, it was found that the MPD



caused some problems with loco interchange so I decided that the DMU depot at the other end of the station was to go.



I have revamped the storage to have the DMU's based there so the MPD will come to this part, extra tracks required.

The existing MPD  this morning looked like this




is no more & looks like this



The space will be used for scenery like houses, etc on a 3mm base so it can  be built off layout & then placed into position - job #895
Paint it the tan colour tomorrow to clean it up, then modify the panel.

 

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That was quick!  The tracks were there when I was there yesterday.  :shock:

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Wow Ron, that was quick! I'm sure the new tracks will be beneficial.

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Now that the old MPD has gone, time to look at the new location - ex DMU's


A couple of diesels  sitting there now. The 2 point motors on the 3-way to be relocated tween the tracks; the existing tracks - two off, to be moved to suit the MPD building & then another loco track plus Fuel/Service track to go in.


The additional 3-way was surplus from the old MPD so it is being put to good use and you can see why the existing motors have to be moved.

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Tracks down & wired - 2 point motors winging their way to me from the UK.




Rare earth magnets installed into the two left tracks.


Now for the revised panel-


 This is as it was - the DMU service tracks now the MPD so additions to be done to this.

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Much better.  :thumbs

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Ron, you do have a 'real' railway there.

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I was thinking Ron, That job 895 housing were you have torn up the tracks. That site looks just like Rose Grove (Preston-Blackburn) in the 1980s, Chuck in some heaps of sleepers and piles of rails with work crews and some machinery, maybe also add semi demolished buildings and it would look the real thing?

cheers,

Derek

Last edited on Fri Jul 1st, 2011 08:20 pm by shunter1

Sol
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Re my Job #895. My train controller mate decided he no longer had a use for these




so they have been plonked ready for some draft  positioning . The actual anchoring will be on a 3mm base to enable full scenic work to be done off -layout before re-setting back into the space.

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Oh, I suppose they'll have to do . . . .   :roll:

Sol
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I will just have to get Gavin Thrum to come to sort them out - Max knows about this modeller here in SA. A sample of his work



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Very nice, Ron.
I see he likes his chimneys!

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Yes, Gavin is a talented modeller - his South Australian outline layout wins trophies each time it is exhibited.

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Sol, I'm sorry and it's nothing personal.

Usually I really love your modelling but the stuff in this shot looks absolutely cr#p.  If you send it up to me in France, I'll try to find somewhere out of sight for it on my planned layout - I'd hate it to spoil yours .................:roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::roll::lol:



p.s. Would your train controller mate like to be my mate as well ? :roll::roll::roll:

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With the arrival today of the outstanding point motors, the MPD trackage etc is finished.  The panel as depicted in post #57 , I cheated & added another piece of MDF at the top (  slightly crappy looking but from the normal operating distance of nearly 2 feet, it will do ) All motors operated via toggles switches & Masterswitch V1's.




 

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The start of Mainline signalling




The signal is from the Eckon range & indicates not only the point leaving from the storage but the status of the Mainline past Barnstable which is around the corner past those low hills.

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And for those who maybe interested, attached is a basic plan of the D&S.

Attachment: Basic plan.zip (Downloaded 15 times)

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Sol wrote: And for those who maybe interested, attached is a basic plan of the D&S.
Thanks Sol  :cheers

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Just an update to the main station of Tawnton.

There are storage tracks behind the station named Tiverton.



the  early days.

 

So I had thought of hiding them so by using 200mm high 5mm thick MDF, I have created a viewing block ( to be painted the pale blue)

tunnels mouths to be added at each end.

A view over the board...





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I'd forgotten how good Tawnton/Tiverton  looks ............:thumbs

How will you access those storage roads Sol ?

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Peter, I can reach over the top with an Ikea stool.

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Glad you left the tracks in. I bet it gives a different perspective to the layout having those tracks now hidden.

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CraigSR wrote: Glad you left the tracks in. I bet it gives a different perspective to the layout having those tracks now hidden.

I had to instal 3 IRDOTS before I contemplated hiding them so I got IRDOTs with 2ft leads for the  emitters & detectors as fitting IRDOTs directly under the tracks as normal was almost an impossibility due to 2 lots of shelving under the layout.

I now can determine which track has a train stored in it so it helps to prevent driving another train into one already stored.

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Now painted




at the far end of the above photo is Metcalfeville

as one can imagine, a lot of work in that area. I think about job # 983 on the list.

In fact Tawnton itself will keep me busy for a loooong time.

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Another small job was to give the brewery an additional track - currently one has fuel tankers & grain hoppers together


temporary tracks to give an idea




now installed



now sleepered & painted

The entire brewery area will take some time in buildings, etc to give it a "proper" look.  Job Number 1004 I think.

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At least you'll be able to enjoy a pint whilst you're doing it Sol. :roll:

That extra siding makes a lot of sense and gives additional "operating potential". :thumbs

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Petermac wrote:
That extra siding makes a lot of sense and gives additional "operating potential". :thumbs

Trouble is Peter, the crew want more money as there are more tracks to work exclam:  A bit rich I thought as the crew member requesting an increase in pay, was the one suggesting the extra track.

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That's the way it goes Sol - I think they call it a "work creation scheme" - keeps them off the dole so you, the taxpayer, don't have to pay them therefore, you can expect a lower tax bill next financial year...............:lol::lol::lol:

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Whatever you two are on - I want some of it.   :chicken

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Don't worry Peter, Max has been side "tracked" for a couple of days- he will be back "on line" soon.

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He's probably busy with his "Tragics" site Sol - I'll pop in and see what's going on ................:cheers

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In earlier threads & posts, I had shown these photos of the staging/storage tracks





Since then, I did modify some tracks to be through running and now well, I've been busy ballasting not only the main line track next to the wall but all others as well ( because they are visible) and I wanted to get it done before I start on the bridge going across all tracks.


 the pointwork to be finished




ready for another group to cast their eyes over the D&S on this coming Sunday.

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It all looks very business-like Sol.

How many tracks are through tracks and, on those that aren't, how do you get the loco to the right end ?

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Peter , of the 9 storage, 3 are through running and any train that goes in loco first to the dead end tracks ( they have auto stop facilites) the brake van & loco are manually reversed ( skycrane) on the train, then backed in ready for its next use some time in a future session

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A PO Grain van for the flour mill at Tawnton




A Parkside Dundas kit

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I think what you have completed is really good I will be watching with interest

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Hi Ron

Looking good as always. I recall that you experimented with micro switches working in conjunction with your peco surface mounted point motors. In one of the pictures I think I can detect a couple of micro switches on two of the points. I played around with a micro switch when I was last home to operate a pair of light signals guarding a junction. I had mixed results. I was wondering how you got on with these in the end. The arrangement I was trialling had a point motor working 3 red/green sets of lights, via a small micro switch. I did not have a CDU in the circuit and the point motor buzzed a bit each time I operated it, but I guess a CDU would sort that out? I would welcome any thoughts you might have.

Bob

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Bob, yes using AC to operate the solenoid motor will give a buzz & a CDU will, I am sure, be better. The setting of the microswitch is fiddly.
The solenoid has to be aligned with tiebar perfectly with good locking spring tension & I find that having the microswitch operate at the end of the lever movement is best - this lets the solenoid do its job first before trying to move another lever.

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Sol wrote: Bob, yes using AC to operate the solenoid motor will give a buzz & a CDU will, I am sure, be better. The setting of the microswitch is fiddly.
The solenoid has to be aligned with tiebar perfectly with good locking spring tension & I find that having the microswitch operate at the end of the lever movement is best - this lets the solenoid do its job first before trying to move another lever.


Ah, thanks for that. I will continue playing with them. My plan was to have lights operating in this way for two reasons: 1. It saves having to operate the lights on a seperate switch as i invariably forget to change them, and 2. I use the lights as route indicators, rather than having an illuminated panel. In my experiments, like you, I found the switches worked best right at the end of the solenoid throw.

Bob

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A revamped Roco track cleaning car for the D&S

Before ( with Kadee couplers plugged in )


after my usual modifications - bogies, couplings body mounted, name plate for the Company initials & dull coated.




to be part of my soon-to-be Goods Express train made up of modified Bachmann VDA vans.
Some minor track changes on the books for the storage of this new train plus Tawnton changes to allow for storage of Local passenger services.

Last edited on Sun Sep 16th, 2012 06:08 am by Sol

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Is that just a "scrubber" Sol or is there some fluid involved ?


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Roco is a "scrubber" type - like a softish Peco track cleaner or the rough surface of masonite ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Masonite )

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Thanks Sol. How well does it work - is the wagon weighted ?  I'd have thought you'd need a reasonable amount of pressure to do much cleaning but maybe I'm not gentle enough with my tracks...............:roll::roll:

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The wagon is heavy - like a small 0-6-0 loco & the pad is sprung keeping it firmly against the rails.
Once the crud has gone using the traditional block ( not Peco but Roco/Fleischmann are better ), then this wagon keeos it clean.

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Long time since I posted on here - one of the main station Tawnton panels needed to be updated.

I combined this


and this - initially controlled by the Train Controller/Dispatcher ( me ) who did not run trains during a session.


added a couple more points,plenty of LED's & ended up with this

I used some bi-colour  yellow/green LEDs



this will allow the Tawnton operator better control of his station.


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That's becoming a work of art, Ron.

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As I laid my track a bit closer to the 6ft way concept ( The term six foot way is railway slang for the 6' spacing between adjacent running lines) , my rails are almost 7ft way & thus the Peco track gauge for adjacent trackage was not accurate, it is more like 8ft way,so  when I wanted to instal a new crossover, I had to modify the tails by removing approx 13-14mm on the outer curved rail.



as you can imagine, fitting this crossover into existing tracks  with insulated fishplates was fun.

I will get a closeup of the joins shortly.

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OK, a close up - yes the gaps are large but a Pannier runs through them slowly even with dead frogs.




as this crossover is about 2'6" - to 2'9" away from the viewer, once painted & ballasted and other scenery prersent, the gaps won't be that noticable.

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Point motors installed & working as they should




the bracket at the bottom of the photo is for the upper level to go in.

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The Upper level.

I  have been a measuring & I reckon I can get at least 3 more long storage tracks in by going up from behind the MPD at Tawnton, across the end of the layout, over the top of Anstey Halt & have a 3 way point near the house wall so the tracks will be at least 5-6" high above some of the St David tracks..  
 

starting of the gradient with the blue line ( yes I know, typical artist, all over the place !)




Norton Halt will be on the MPD side of the existing track




climbing over Anstey Halt ( I even changed the building from a small station building to a Halt)




then over the existing storage with 3 tracks near the wall for storage and a small station, like Mynend, slewed at an angle to allow Charde Op to be in charge




If I can make the new station removable like Charde is and do not fully hide the existing base level storage, access if required should be OK.

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The following may as well get posted here as compared to me creating a new Thread.


While I will still read most threads as a Mod & comment occasionally, posting by me about the D&S will cease for some time for the following 3 reasons:
1. doing an extension to the layout with additional storage sidings & another small station  as per the piost above re the Upper Level - I hope to remember to take photos.
2. a completely new paper operating system using individual cards/waybills creating more flexibility ( plus more work for me !!)
3. rewiring all electrically operated points (55 of) from dedicated CDU's; DCCconcepts Masterswitch & the Canadian PCB units to that of a single capacitor & diodes next to the solenoid & requiring just one wire back to the panels combined with LEDs to indicate point direction will be from the toggle switch, not a solenoid mounted accessory switch & dead frogs so a reduction from 4 wires to one. A lot of work but it will be simpler in the long run. At least 3 new panels required to replace the existing.





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Just a quick posting to show the planned baseboards for the extensions.

In red - the dotted line indicates where I hope to be able to split the station so it can be lifted off.




 

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Perhaps give periodic reports on progress, Ron?
Be a shame to miss out on our ration of D&S.

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The gradient has started behind Tawnton MPD



around the corner over Norton Jn. The gap in the gradient baseboard is for a Truss bridge en-route from Walthers



and over Anstey Halt



gotta seal the joins with PVA or similar before track is pinned, etc  & paint the brackets the pale blue.

Between the start of the gradient to the bridge, it will be rock face, etc - after the bridge. I will, I think, just paint the wood edge either  pale blue
or a tan colour.



 

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Top left (last pic) looks like flexitrack, Ron.
Will you be able to pin it securely with the gap between the supports?

Good to see it coming on - some ingenious woodwork there.

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Yes Pete. Peco Code 100 flex & it will pin OK as I pre-drill with about a #70 drill & use Peco pins SL14 and gently tap them in.

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Hi Ron.

I will watch with interest as I have been messing about with gradients on my layout and have not been entirely happy with the results. Some lessons I have learned is that gradients with curves can seriously affect the pulling power of locos, causing them to stop with wheel spin. It is worth checking all your trains move easily with the maximum load they are likely to pull. Ensuring DCC decoders have back EMF capability is very important to ensure smooth running. Finally having points on or near the gradient can cause a lot of problems as the weight of the train can distort the track slightly causing derailments. I hope it works for you. Looking at your gradient and curve, from the pictures it should be OK, but lots of trials before ballasting etc is recommended.

Bob

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Very true Bob ; the first 330mm, it rises approx 12mm making it 1:27.5


Right, some test results  - all starting from a dead stop right after the frog as the gradient commences


A Bachmann Pannier with 3 Surburban coaches  - no problems   and a Bachmann Class 25 with the 3 coaches, a Queen Mary brake van & 19 Bachmann hoppers,  easily handled it.   The Class 37 that normally has the hoppers also had no problems with a standing start.


The expected  longest train that will go up the gradient, will be 7 coaches hauled by a 47 class or around 15 wagons by Class 24 upwards.
But I do have an advantage, if necessary, I can double head using DCC as I will be adjusting loco speeds to be the same.


Just tried 6 coaches & a Bachmann Class 47 makes the first grade & curve & then a straighter section of track where the bridge will be & not so steep, gives it a breather.

A Class 45 not so good but with double heading with a Class 25, no problems.


I will have to wait until I get the track around over Anstey Halt to see how it goes with 7 coaches.


 

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Looks promising - and an excuse for some 'testing' too! :lol:

Bob

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Bob, after much more testing with various loco types & quantities of wagons & coaches, and discussions with a couple of the operating crew, the idea of splitting passenger trains & sending each part off to a different destination has merit.

This overcomes the naturally steep gradient right at the start of the curve. That is the problem one finds when trying to adapt an existing plan without too much track removal!

7 coach trains will come into  the main station from storage, are then split into 4 & 3 coach trains - 4 going to  another storage location  with 3 up the hill to Newton Abbott .  Have to keep the staff gainfully employed at the main station!


This is what I get in trying to have an "operating" layout for a group of mates - if I wanted just to watch trains run around & around life would have been easier!




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That's a realistic solution Sol. :thumbs

Have you got as far as thinking about the timetable for the new route ?  You'll have to allow enough time for the splitting ..........:hmm

You'd soon get bored just watching trains go round and round ................:cheers

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Petermac wrote: That's a realistic solution Sol. :thumbs

Have you got as far as thinking about the timetable for the new route ?  You'll have to allow enough time for the splitting ..........:hmm  working on that as I type - real good fun working them all out.

You'd soon get bored just watching trains go round and round ................:cheers agreed

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Before I get too carried away with the upper level, I have to do some track changes & related wiring alteraions in the  existing storage that will be underneath the high level
for example
the 3 way point with the horizontal piece of chalk will be removed & replaced by the point with the vertical piece of chalk

ending up like this

just one of the many changes to be undertaken.

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Being involved on a new replacement point control panel on other part of the layout, the gradient & bridges had been delayed but now back into it.

This is what I  plan to use



while I can provide realistic supports at the left hand end & in the middle, the right hand end is a bit problematical




not sure what to do - the idea of some tunnels springs to mind over the 3 tracks ....thinking....

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Looking at that last shot Sol, is there room between the two rear tracks for a wall ?  The rear track could be in a tunnel with the next one tight up to the embankment wall carrying the bridge track ..........:hmm

Alternatively, you could do what they do with the road underpasses here in France - a series of concrete pillars rather than a solid wall ..........:roll:

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Thanks Peter, that is something to measure up.

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Out of this chaos, hopefully a Phoenix will arise






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Maybe extended concrete 'rafts' to meet pillars at a convenient site on that right hand side, Ron?

I have photos of the real thing somewhere but can't lay my hands on them at the minute.
Possibly on a monorail.

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Your chaos is nowhere near as chaotic as my chaos Sol ..................:cry::cry:

I'm still looking for my Phoenix ........:???:

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Something like this, Ron.

The 'plinth' could be as wide as necessary to be on top of the posts in a convenient location.

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Thanks Pete, that is the sort of thing I have in mind.

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Sol wrote: Being involved on a new replacement point control panel on other part of the layout, the gradient & bridges had been delayed but now back into it.

This is what I  plan to use



while I can provide realistic supports at the left hand end & in the middle, the right hand end is a bit problematical




not sure what to do - the idea of some tunnels springs to mind over the 3 tracks ....thinking....

Hmmm, backed yourself into a corner there Sir!

As you said, probably a tunnel - open arched sides perhaps - or a rather wide and silly looking upturned 'U' support - so a bit of a problem there but nothing a determined modeller such as your good self cannot overcome!

Best of luck, you'll get around it, or in this case, over it, somehow.

Allan.


 

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Allan, following  some discussions with the crew, I intend to hide the track that is underneath the upper track with a tunnel & shift the adjacent track away a bit.
I have started with the original placements



and moved the middle track



since that photo, I have now fully shifted the middle track around to the right end - this will give me room for a cliff face, etc.

Last edited on Sat Mar 16th, 2013 09:50 pm by Sol

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Good move, Ron.
When offering possible solutions, one doesn't like to suggest ripping up track!

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ddolfelin wrote:  one doesn't like to suggest ripping up track!
part of the fun of this hobby is change.

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It's amazing how the "best laid plans of (mice and) men" need to be altered time and time again and it seems particularly true in railway modelling; what 'fun' though! :roll:

Ken.

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A good move with the cliff face Sol - it explains the bridge. :thumbs

If you make the cliff face removable, you'll be able to get at that hidden track.  All you need is a "vertical" landscaped panel, held in place perhaps by a magnetic catch.

Easier still, a high retaining wall like Gordon used on some of his different levels on "Eastwood" .............:roll::roll:

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I have been busy installing six  Kadee electromagnets into the two platform lines in Tawnton & altering the western end station throat

One magnet as ballasted with yellow sleepers to identify location a LED to assist in operations.



the revised throat



updated panel - red buttons for electromagnets

plus new panels for storage & junctions



 

combined with working on creating timetables fro passenger & goods services.

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It's getting too advanced for me, Ron.

My TV went off the other day.
I checked the fuse by trying it in a lamp.
Worked perfectly so I replaced it in the TV plug.
The TV came on.
Just an illustration of the mysteries that surround me when I venture into the electrickery field.

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ddolfelin wrote: It's getting too advanced for me, Ron.

My TV went off the other day.
I checked the fuse by trying it in a lamp.
Worked perfectly so I replaced it in the TV plug.
The TV came on.
Just an illustration of the mysteries that surround me when I venture into the electrickery field.

I wouldn't mind betting the problem wasn't the fuse DD. ;-)

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There's a very simple way of checking a fuse:-

Switch on a torch, remove the end cap, place fuse with one end touching the battery and the other end touching the torch casing and if the torch lights up it's ok.

Ken

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Yes - or try it in the TV.

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Having finished the trackwork etc with the new upper lever storage & station, in between many other aspects of the hobby, I was unhappy re the gradient going to the upper level, - starting right on a corner



and combined with removing storage tracks that were behind the main station,






I started to clean the trackwork off and the new gradient would start approx where the rod van is situated






This shows where the gradient starts



as compared to the distant green bus

New junction and gradient on the LH side

 





looking the other way






 

now to wire it all up !!

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Love the point work :Happy

Don't you just wish the little fairies would come along and wire it for you

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Nice sweep of track there Ron.
So another one joins the wire dropper gang!

regards,
Derek.

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The new Tiverton Junction all wired up with a new panel



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For those YMRers who may have read the various versions of this layout  from
http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=1344&forum_id=21
http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=1498&forum_id=21
http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=5948&forum_id=21
and the various station threads

in another place discussing hand build turnouts,  I posted this

RTR turnouts - no matter what breed, are perfect for those who are:
1, lazy  or
2, have two left thumbs  or
3, wanting to get the layout up & running quickly   or
4, saving money as a hand-built unit may only cost  1/4 of RTR units or
5, a combination of the above.

I started off the new layout with the idea of having RTR in storage & hand-built all out in open.
As can be seen on my layout thread, I did do many hand-built turnouts - 3 ways, diamonds for starters
but it was point 3 from above that decided me to use Peco & Tillig.


Now the "running quickly" was not because of my desire to see trains run but as a place for fellow modellers
to be involved with,  in operating sessions.


Perhaps in hindsight, I should have kept going on the hand-built regime but at the same time,
operating sessions with more than one person shows up the deficiencies of the layout plan.
I have done many small /larger changes due to these sessions & the RTR turnouts do make changes quicker to do
& get back into operating.


While I am reasonably happy with the overall concept plan of the D&S, I have made a couple of mistakes
and to fix these would mean almost a complete new re-build & I don't feel like starting again - if I did,
I would not expect to be operating with crew for a couple of years at least and a reduced crew size as well.







********************************************************************************

A rebuild for me would entail so much work basically from woodwork up; not so wide baseboards
( back from 34- 40"  to around 24")  & storage lower down and more accessible;   centre peninsula
from  18" to 36" and aisles from 26"  to 30"  & the centre peninsula would be the main focus station -
a terminal worked from one side.. Two other small terminals & 2 storage areas. It could mean just 4 operators
including me - one for each small terminal plus a storage  & two for the main station

All  turnouts  motorised from panels & better signalling.

Something I really should have done a few years ago - I think a bit late now.  But some thing to sleep on.

Last edited on Sun Jan 5th, 2014 12:44 pm by Sol

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:)Best of luck Ron.

The axe just wears one out in the end :sad:.

As you run your railway with fellow minded railway operator,s, It makes sense to keep things flowing.

Constant starts and stops can kill the group,s enthusiasm. Plus one can get frustrated with the whole hobby.

My axe has been banished to hades.

Now enjoying a build that may well see loco,s running in the not to distant future.

regards,

Derek.

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This is the basic plan as if sitting in the aisles/operating area


and this is the plan in a line format - should help Operators

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And this is the plan for the running of the D&S in theoretical real life



station names  with the yellow background are visible, all others storage & hidden

Sol
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As mentioned in my Marabost thread, the basic track plan has changed and it is attached for information.  The file contains 3 pages.

Attachment: dandsplans_version X.xlsx (Downloaded 13 times)

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I couldn't open that in excel Ron,i had to use Libre office.

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What version Excel have you got Alan? you may need to read these
http://support.microsoft.com/kb/924074 or
http://voices.yahoo.com/how-open-xlsx-files-3000748.html

but yes Open Office / Libre Office reads the later versions of Excel files.

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Just excel starter edition which apparently has expired so Libre office it is then.

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All track changes finished & have been busy on paperwork for operating sessions & building a mimic wall panel  with LEDs for the junctions, etc so the crew are aware of how tracks are set. It also duplicates signals.


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that panel looks the biz must try one myself,,,
:thumbs;-):cool:

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A couple more turnout additions, etc to help the shunting.

Tawnton looking from the West - high & low level photos





now looking from the east



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Lovely work Ron,
I do like the way you have curved your track beds it looks very prototype.To many of us get obsessed with straight tracks a rare thing in real life station and goods yard area,s.
The track plan and panel are also first class and those overboard point motors don't look too bad with a bit of weathering and some railway junk they will blend in very well.Plus a bonus you save your back and head from crawling under the boards.
Cheers,
Derek.

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Wow !!! You've been a busy boy in the last year Ron. Great track laying with lovely flowing curves which will add to the realism once you get round to the scenic setting.

Merry Christmas to you.

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Some scenery at the Flour Mill end of Tawnton... tracks on the left are from Barnstable

 

the road/ turnout mix - leads to Charde & Durston


the main track to the right where the road has not continued on, is the main track into Tawnton




Low level




still lots of detailing to do.

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Love the low level shot of Tawnton Ron.Looks like it will give a lot of operational opportunities.

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Spurno wrote: Love the low level shot of Tawnton Ron.Looks like it will give a lot of operational opportunities.

Alan, in a normal Operating session,  3 blokes are in Tawnton - one each end and a Station Master to keep across all timetabled trains in & out of Tawnton.

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This looks really impressive, Ron.  Wish mine was progressing as well!!

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Very nice work Ron. I particularly like the road crossing. 

How did you manage to get the flangeways so neat and clean ??

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Chinahand wrote: Very nice work Ron. I particularly like the road crossing. 

How did you manage to get the flangeways so neat and clean ??

Trevor, I use thick card based on a paper template.

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Aaah. Thanks Ron.

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Part of Tawnton  housing - much detail to add





behind the flour mill - an area to be filled


a little add-on building - this angle not normally seen


now to finish off the ground cover, etc  - Job # 875

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Ron, all I can say is WOW that is now some layout, brill,,:doublethumb
:thumbs;-):cool:

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some ground scenery added

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Looking good there Ron, just flicked through the before and after shots and its amazing the difference some grass ,weeds and dirt can make


Proper Job     :thumbs

Last edited on Wed Jul 15th, 2015 05:48 pm by

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Tawnton East - one building to go - Carpet Co depot

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Fits in well Ron.  What,s next?

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The other end of the station Reg, MPD & a brewery - then in the middle with two signal boxes & main station building.

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Blimey it`s getting busy in there Ron,

I hope you`ve got plenty of assistants to help you run your layout.???

:thumbs:thumbs:thumbs:thumbs

:cheers  Gormo

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Normally Gormo, me as Train Controller plus 6 others being drivers/shunters/Station Masters - twice a month for about 2 hours plus each session.

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Gee.. Ron that sounds like a good bit of fun..!!
Sounds like it could get a bit hectic with that many folks on the one layout.???
Cheers 
Gormo

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While it may seem I have left the hobby, far from it.

Timetables, etc plus some buildings have kept me busy  but operationally, a couple of areas needed to be fixed.
Outside of the wall panel that displays turnout status


which is going to be replaced with a larger more encompassing track diagram, the main station Tawnton  which has 2 platform tracks & 4 goods loops and has two panels




will be combined into one and the main two goods loops 1 & 2 will also be equipped with solenoids.
To do this meant 3 existing handmade turnouts need to be replaced and this required some minor track re-alignments to boot

The turnout at the West end
before


ripped out


then replaced - you can see the other track re-alignment



Tawnton East had 2 turnouts to be replaced


and after removing existing


then replacement all with large radius Peco Code 75


even the Y turnout with the white on the tiebar end, had to be lifted to allow a rod for the solenoid to work to as the knob on the end of the tiebar had been removed.

All good "fun" - in fact the easiest part of the "improvements"

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Both ends now finished...



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Might be a stupid question Sol, but what's the red dotted lines and the black arrow?


Ed

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Ed, the red dots indicate both turnouts operate at the same time & the black arrow, added to the photo, was to indicate to my crew that the turnout pointed to, would be a separate control when the panel is rebuilt.

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Hi Ron,

Just an observation...do you need the point motors on the surface as they are a bit obtrusive.

Phil

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Phil, they do look a bit out of place but I wasn't going to cut big holes for underneath mounted units - there is so much wiring ....
If I started again from scratch, things would be different - possibly Tortoise/Cobalt

but the layout was designed not so much as a "realistic" scene but for operation by a crew. (And as I find out, changes have been done to make operation "better")

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Sol wrote: Ed, the red dots indicate both turnouts operate at the same time & the black arrow, added to the photo, was to indicate to my crew that the turnout pointed to, would be a separate control when the panel is rebuilt.
Ah, makes sense :thumbs


Ed

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So why change to solenoid Sol? Had the original manual system failed?

Looks good by the way. Nice and tidy.

Cheers

Marty

Last edited on Tue Jun 7th, 2016 06:08 pm by Marty

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Marty wrote: So why change to solenoid Sol? Had the original manual system failed?
Marty, some of the 4 tracks in which incoming trains arrive on, had some turnouts-  manual & electric and to make it easier for the Crew is have all the same way and electric is the way

Looks good by the way. Nice and tidy.  Thanks

Cheers

Marty

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The new combined panel has been started...

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Panel now with toggles & LEDs


looks like a Christmas tree when all LEDs are working - panel starts to be installed next Thursday

Big red buttons are for the Kadee electromagnets on the platform tracks.

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Nice Sol,
Are the LEDs for occupancy or routing?
Marty

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Marty, for turnout direction only.

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This is how the D&S works to all stations - a point to point layout



Stations with a yellow background are visible &  have buildings, etc so the crew have somewhere to shunt into.
Names in Italics are storage - some are hidden.

To fit this into my space, I have had to incorporate gradients & diamonds. By cunning use of turnouts at Anstey Jn , I do have a continuous run available if needed.

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Continuous run is good Sol......................:roll:

That way, you can sit a watch trains go by whilst you sip your coffee or other beverage ..........:cheers:cheers

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continuos runs are very relaxing so enjoy Ron
:thumbs;-):cool:Owen

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Since I did the wall panel as per Post 169 and the new combined Tawnton panel on Post 170, I haven't done much in the way of scenery but involved in Timetables & the associated paperwork to move trains around with modifications found after each Op session and the light is at the end of the tunnel now....

Tidied up the panels for Dispatcher/ Main signal box/ Main line & storage turnouts  and after a couple of crossovers added, also rebuilt the main wall display panel  which is more in keeping with how the layout actually looks.

Marty
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Are the red LEDs signal repeaters Sol?
cheers

Marty

Sol
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Marty, the re LEDs are actually bi-colour-  red / green and are repeaters so the crew can see them better than those on the track side.
The 3 signals in a vertical row at the top will in time be also on a signal gantry using one of these

Marty
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Very nice! 
You are too kind to your operators. 

Cheers

Marty

Sol
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Just a couple of photos to show that I am still alive...



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Very nice, Sol - but they could have been taken by anyone.

Are you sure that you're still alive?  :roll:

Sol
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"Anyone" does not have the keys to the Rail Empire....

And after some work out in the garden, I am sure I am not alive :mutley

Sol
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Built a little halt on the branch line to Charde



this is where it is going.



base timber work




now on brick piers.





timber planks courtesy of Excel; roof cardboard Galvanised iron;   ramp & steps to go

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Nice work, Sol.  :thumbs

There's always room for another halt.  :lol:

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Looking good Sol ;-)

Sol
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Ramp & steps done - walkway across tracks next...




and this is the other little halt on the way to Newton Abbot...

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:thumbs

Marty
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I like the new halt Sol, did the passenger driver/operator complain of not having enough stops to service?
Cheers

Marty

Sol
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Yes Marty, a bit of that but the idea was to give the terminal stations drivers a bit more to do instead of sitting around contemplating their navel while waiting the main station to finish shunting their trains !

Marty
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Gotta keep them working!
👍

Last edited on Fri Aug 18th, 2017 10:36 am by Marty

Sol
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Thanks Alan/Spurno for the Picture of the week.

As I said back in February, I have been a bit slack on scenery and the small platform of a couple of weeks agostill has to be finished off but other things get in the way...

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Congratulations, Sol.   :cheers

I rarely get to look at the Home Page, as I usually go in by the email links.

Marty
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Nice to see one of the earliest and longest featured layouts on this forum on the header page again. Well done Al and Sol.
Marty

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Hi Sol Congratulations Home Page picture of the week. WoW twice in one year. Well done.
D&S Layout very nice, I like your re build plan, s. New ideas always welcome.

Had you found place for Mill Wear House, Last model build.

Up Date plus pic, s please.

Best of Luck From South Wales U.K.

Noviceman.

Sol
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Noviceman., thanks.

 I haven't built the Mill warehouse - I was just advising all of the new release - I have no room for it....

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Hi Ron.   The "Fun" with code 83 and code 100, was that "Tongue in Cheek"? And did you have to use a file??All the best. Kevin

Sol
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Passed Driver wrote: Hi Ron.   The "Fun" with code 83 and code 100, was that "Tongue in Cheek"? And did you have to use a file??All the best. Kevin



Solder a code 100 metal fishplate to code 100 rail for 50% of the fishplate length, flatten the other 50% & solder the code 75/83 rail to this flattened piece of fishplate ( with the inside edges of both code 75 & 100 in alignment.)
A  file just to touch the top surface up.

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Hi Ron.  Thank you, I may try that? one day.    Kevin

Sol
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Noviceman wrote:
Had you found place for Mill Wear House, Last model build.



Best of Luck From South Wales U.K.

Noviceman.

Noviceman, there is a N scale version on this post
http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=15110&forum_id=21&jump_to=273256#p273028

Sol
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Finally got the Dapol signal gantry almost finished - just the railing to install but it lights up now



this one shows all the wires but they are very hard to see normally.

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Hi Ron.    Well done, there aren't enough model railway layouts with working signals.  All the best. Kevin

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Looks good!


                 

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