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RR&Co - Max's shunting puzzle. - RR & Co - Getting You Started. - Your Model Railway Club
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 Posted: Sat Sep 25th, 2010 03:48 am
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John Dew
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Glad the sequence worked Max...............and of course one lives and learns.......maybe I should use STOP rather than speed

I am assuming Block 4 is the start Block and Block 8 is the destination block and then as a result of the end of schedule operations the Train moves into Block 10? 

This may have some problems.......does TC recognise that the loco has moved into Block 10 and is Block 8 shown as empty?

An alternative (which I used in similar circumstances) is to have two schedules

[1] Block 4 to Block 8

[2] Block 8 to Block 10..............use a schedule specific stop marker at the end of schedule in Block 10 to replace some of the operations in your macro  

I think you will find this simpler and more accurate.......just a thought



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 Posted: Sat Sep 25th, 2010 06:55 am
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MaxSouthOz
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That's right, John.  And you'll have noticed that I have extra reversal arrows as well.

What's complicating it is that the loco goes all the way to the end of Block 8 before it encounters the wagons.  I reckon I'll divide the work up again.  I will probably have to have an extra small Schedule in there.

The AFL Grand Final is on, so I'm a bit distracted at the minute.  :Happy



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 Posted: Sat Sep 25th, 2010 07:55 am
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wogga
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MaxSouthOz wrote:
I have to work out a way for TC to recognise the B&S markers in Block 8, do the shuffle and then continue to Block 10 to end the Schedule.  It's not ideal, but if I don't sort the slips out, the wagons will derail as the motors are in their last used position from the earlier Schedules.


As John says Max i would break it into another sched, drive into block 8 get your shuffle done at the end of the sched then have a successor sched that moves the train into 10.

I think bitesize pieces are the way to go Max, i think when we are all a bit more  smarter we can make it a more complicated.

I mean when i was travelling around Surrey by train in my squaddie days, one commuter train used to arrive at Surbiton, i think it was, and it would split, one half continued into London the other half went somewhere else,

So RR&co must be able to this? arrive at a through station do a stop, do a shuffle, then have two concurrent departures, in reality not much different to your ops i suppose in a fashion.



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 Posted: Sat Sep 25th, 2010 08:32 am
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MaxSouthOz
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That's right, Pete.  Unfortunately I can't get the shuffle done until I can couple.  That means I have to go past the magnet and come back, because the track is too curved.  At least all the tools are working for me now.  I just need to re-think it.

That's what makes TC so addictive.  :thumbs

The Grand Final was a draw by the way.  We do it all again next week.  :Red Card



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 Posted: Sat Sep 25th, 2010 02:08 pm
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wogga
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MaxSouthOz wrote:
That's what makes TC so addictive.  :thumbs Tell me about it!:roll:

The Grand Final was a draw by the way.  W do it all again next week.  :Red CardWhat can i say :oops:



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 Posted: Mon Sep 27th, 2010 12:53 pm
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MaxSouthOz
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I'm sure everyone will be relieved to hear that I have finished writing the 29 Schedules for the Shunting Puzzle.  :thudI reckon I can do Schedules, B&S markers, etc., etc., in my sleep, now.  :shock:

The coupler sounds are still a bit of a challenge.  Putting them on the stop markers won't work as the same markers are used for stopping the loco when there is no wagon attached (running around, for example).  I tried putting them in the shuffle sequence, but I haven't nailed it yet.

Excellent advice from John about marking everything with comments and tags.  :thumbs  It makes it much easier to double check as I go through.  I think I need a cuppa.  exclam:



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 Posted: Mon Sep 27th, 2010 04:58 pm
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Well done Max, it sounds that you had chosen a complicated routine to learn with but you have succeeded, i will be checking the movie section soon...no pressure.

You have nailed the principles Max now its down to your imagination  absolutely smashing mate.:doublethumb

I see what you say about the sound being attached to the stop marker, it sounds like you need to investigate virtual contacts which i used for my flange squeal. Basically i put a virtual contact to activate the flange squeal function on a loco 5cm's after the branchline CI was activated. in both directions and it is just right on the curve.

Maybe a VC will sort it and you should be able to apply the VC only to certain schedules i.e. the one where the coupling is done  your not finished yet!



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 Posted: Mon Sep 27th, 2010 05:14 pm
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John Dew
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wogga wrote: Well done Max, it sounds that you had chosen a complicated routine to learn with but you have succeeded, i will be checking the movie section soon...no pressure.

You have nailed the principles Max now its down to your imagination  absolutely smashing mate.:doublethumb



Well done indeed Max............thats great...........glad my bit about the notes helped

I see what you say about the sound being attached to the stop marker, it sounds like you need to investigate virtual contacts which i used for my flange squeal. Basically i put a virtual contact to activate the flange squeal function on a loco 5cm's after the branchline CI was activated. in both directions and it is just right on the curve.

Maybe a VC will sort it and you should be able to apply the VC only to certain schedules i.e. the one where the coupling is done  your not finished yet!


 

You are ahead of me again Pete!:lol: I was going to do a post about virtual contacts because Max will need them to enter TC occupied blocks..............but I modelled instead 

You may find that an Action Indicator will do the same thing and is simpler to set up

Regards



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 Posted: Mon Sep 27th, 2010 05:51 pm
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An Action Indicator John? i must do some more digging but not yet i have some modelling to first! and move the layout and put some new point motors in and..........



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 Posted: Mon Sep 27th, 2010 06:22 pm
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John Dew
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wogga wrote: An Action Indicator John? i must do some more digging but not yet i have some modelling to first! and move the layout and put some new point motors in and..........
I started another thread........ I have a cunning plan...........perhaps



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 Posted: Mon Sep 27th, 2010 06:42 pm
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John Dew wrote: wogga wrote: An Action Indicator John? i must do some more digging but not yet i have some modelling to first! and move the layout and put some new point motors in and..........
I started another thread........ I have a cunning plan...........perhaps

Go for it!



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 Posted: Mon Sep 27th, 2010 09:57 pm
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MaxSouthOz
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Thanks, guyz.  As you can imagine I was a bit knackered last night when I finished.  I want to run it over several nights, checking for glitches.  There shouldn't be, but the mechanical vagueries of the models can introduce some slight variations.  The curves added some challenges as well; a wagon being pushed while uncoupled can recouple on a bend, for example.  :shock:

The movie could still be a little while, Pete.  I'm still casting the lead roles.  :mutley



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 Posted: Mon Sep 27th, 2010 10:49 pm
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MaxSouthOz wrote: The curves added some challenges as well; a wagon being pushed while uncoupled can recouple on a bend, for example.  :shock:



Max, that should not happen if the loco coupler has a constant pressure on the wagon coupler in the delayed setting even on curves.  To my knowledge, only three things can cause a re-couple:

1. a jerk in the loco by either track power missing or

2. trackwork not flat at a join    or

3. the wagon being pushed is so light and free running, it moves away too quickly allowing the couplers to part & restore to normal.

1 - track power is a b**** to correct all the time. 

2. Trackwork joins takes some maintenance

3- by having the wagon a bit heavier & retarding the free running slightly.

My suggestions for what they are worth ( 99 cents to the $ ?)

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 Posted: Mon Sep 27th, 2010 11:14 pm
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MaxSouthOz
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It's probably the third one, Sol.  It's a Bachmann and the one I've had the most trouble with.  The coupler pockets were the wrong height and had to be packed up/down? among other things.  It's got the right amount of weight in it, so maybe I should substitute the metal wheel sets for plastic?  Anyway, it's not a problem now, as I just put in another shuffle further along the track.



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 Posted: Tue Sep 28th, 2010 10:27 pm
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MaxSouthOz
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I just spent 15 minutes looking for my comment on the double slips, but I can't find it.  Maybe the Mods have deleted it?  Anyway, I'm sorry  for posting in the thread.  I missed the instruction at the top.

It looks like I will have to re-do the last half of my sequence as the Bachmann wagon is still giving me grief.  Because of the tightness of the curves the coupler goes right across to one side and comes back as it goes around the bend and then locks in.  Nothing to do with poor track laying or loose wheels.

I tried to make the trackwork look "interesting," by putting in curves, but the Kadee system only works properly on straight track.  I might have to pull it all up and start again.  Added to that TC decided to shut the loco sound off halfway through last night.  It still works using the LH 100, so there is something wrong in the software side.

I really wanted a break from RR&Co, but I have visitors coming on the weekend and I had hoped to have it working to show them.  I'll spend every evening this week trying to get it fixed, but they might just miss out.



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 Posted: Tue Sep 28th, 2010 11:14 pm
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John Dew
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MaxSouthOz wrote: I just spent 15 minutes looking for my comment on the double slips, but I can't find it.  Maybe the Mods have deleted it?  Anyway, I'm sorry  for posting in the thread.  I missed the instruction at the top.

Thats maybe my fault Max...........I asked Brian to move it to the FAQ thread in this Forum. I did mention double slips in the tute......and promised to write a separate section about them because its a bit complex.

The notice is new....I put it there after your post;-)

I tried to make the trackwork look "interesting," by putting in curves, but the Kadee system only works properly on straight track.  I might have to pull it all up and start again. 
Thats my experience also......I find even on a slight bend they either dont uncouple or if they do they couple up when pushed.....quite probably because of one of Sol's three reasons.......but in the end I have been obliged to move the magnet to a staraight bit to get 100% performance

I do hope you dont have to pull up the track and start again

Regards 

 



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 Posted: Tue Sep 28th, 2010 11:29 pm
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Whew exclam:   That's a relief, John.   I've sent you a PM about it as well.  :oops:

I've been looking at the trackwork and there's a straighter bit of track further back from the slips which I might try.

The sound switching off is a bit of a worry, though.  I'll start running tests again tonight.  It might have been a one off.  I had to go out to band rehersal for our gig on Sunday, so I didn't have time to play with it.

Cheers  Max



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 Posted: Tue Sep 28th, 2010 11:48 pm
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The uncoupling magnet has to be on the straight track ( http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/page321.htm) but I have no problems, once uncoupled in pushing through 24" radius curves as long as the loco or wagons do not jerk.

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 Posted: Tue Sep 28th, 2010 11:55 pm
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The magnet is on straight track, Sol.  It's that the curved approaches that cause the trouble, turning the body of the loco.  The straight sections just have to be longer.  The curves we're pushing through are probably tighter than yours, as the coupler swings a long way.



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 Posted: Wed Sep 29th, 2010 12:41 am
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True, straighter section of track for uncoupler so the couplers are centred. I find pushing back down to 15" radius is no problems but of course they do have to be left on a straight section to re-couple later. And with USA/longer bodies, longer sections of straight are required.

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