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H0 Scale - South Shore Line - Members Personal Layouts. - Model Railway Layouts. - Your Model Railway Club
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 Posted: Wed Oct 24th, 2007 07:27 pm
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Wayne Williams
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Welcome all to the "South Shore Line"! I have decided to name my layout after the South Shore that runs through New Carlisle, Indiana. Stay posted for updates including my new, revised, altered, modified....etc. layout. :lol: I just emptied the trash can of all the old ideas. :wink: It was FULL!

Wayne



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 Posted: Wed Oct 24th, 2007 07:41 pm
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Gwent Rail
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now's a good time to start at the beginning and "set the secene" for us.
Size, scale, era and initial ideas are good to get down "on paper" early, so that we can all follow progress logically.

Over to you :!: :!: :wink:

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 Posted: Wed Oct 24th, 2007 09:23 pm
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Wayne Williams
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The South Shore Line began in 1903 as a street car (AC Electric) service across 68.9 miles from northern Indiana to Chicago. In 1925 it was converted from AC electric to its current 1500 volt DC system. By 1938 ridership of the South Shore was 6 million annual passengers and has declined ever since. In 1909, 1933, 1976, & 1989, the South Shore went bankrupt. Each time the government helped to bail it out.
In 1983 forty-four new multiple unit, motorized cars were put into service. The South Shore currently carries around 3 1/2 million passengers annually.

As a child growing up in Northern Indiana, the South Shore ran about 1/4 mile back behind my house. If I think about it, I can still hear the whistles blowing all night long (seemed like it anyway). I rode that train to Chicago on my way to the Navy in 1965. The overhead electric wires disappeared somewhere between my Navy life and my second marriage, but we won't go into that here.
More to come........ :P

Wayne



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 Posted: Wed Oct 24th, 2007 09:59 pm
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Wayne Williams
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The scale I have choosen is HO, as for the era I am leaning towards 2007. By picking today I can take photos of any of the buildings in town and model from them. They really haven't changed much since back then anyway.
My room size is about 9 x 15. The layout size will be 9' x 13'-6". One problem I have is the 15 foot wall is nothing but windows. They start 18" up from the floor and are 72" high.
I would like to model several buildings from downtown and the grain elevator. My high school was torn down in 1970, but I would still like to include it in the layout, so much for adhearing to the era! :cry: The town area on the layout will fit onto one sheet of plywood, so I have a lot of other area to fill. :D My current thinking is: as you view the layout from left to right the elevation will steadily rise into mountains into which the trains will disappear.
I am still going back and forth on DC or DCC. With my current plan I have very little switching, so DC may be a good way to start, then later switch to DCC if a need should arise. It would help to keep the cost down too.
Another point of contention is two walls of the room are concrete stucco and with another wall all windows, I will not be able to attach the layout to anything but the floor... :cry: just kidding, won't do that either. So, this layout is going to be free standing.
I will be posting a layout sketch soon. 8)

Wayne

PS: The construction of my layout room just got set back two to three weeks. :evil: :evil: :evil: :evil:



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 Posted: Wed Oct 24th, 2007 10:51 pm
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MikeC
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Sorry to read of the delay in starting. I suppose it gives you a bit more time to plan.
Your project sounds very interesting, and will add nicely to the already wide variety we have on here.

Mike

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 Posted: Thu Oct 25th, 2007 02:51 am
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Perry
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I'm looking forward to seeing this layout develop, Wayne. It sounds very promising. It would be great if you could show us some photos of it as you progress. :D

Perry



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 Posted: Thu Oct 25th, 2007 03:24 am
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Bob K
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Wayne really looking forward to seeing this project grow. If you are starting from scratch and you do want DCC in the future I would consider going DCC from the beginning. It will save you money and effort in the long run.

Novice

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 Posted: Thu Oct 25th, 2007 06:26 am
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lockboys
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Sounds good Wayne :D I will watch with bated breath as it develops :wink:
Have you guys ever thought about the fact that your layout is dictated by the room you have chosen to do it in :roll: and you have to fit it into that room with as much operation that you can :shock:
I have noticed tho that most guys seem to be able to use every bit of space they have available to themselves :P :lol:

Darryl

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 Posted: Thu Oct 25th, 2007 11:51 am
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Robert
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You could always stick a wooden batten to the wall with something like NoMoreNails Wayne, as stability can be quite a problem with free standing layouts.



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 Posted: Thu Oct 25th, 2007 11:58 am
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rector
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It all sounds very exciting, Wayne. Can't wait for that track plan! I will echo what Novice said about starting off in DCC. It would save hours and days of wiring work, and simplify the entire design.

I speak as one who made this tough call just a month ago :shock:

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 Posted: Thu Oct 25th, 2007 02:13 pm
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phill
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Sounds as thou it is going to be some model. Look forward to the future threads.
Phill

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 Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 08:17 am
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Diesel
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Same here look forward to more threads on this



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 Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 08:54 am
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Wayne Williams
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In regards to my "Free Standing" layout, two of the Interior walls of this room are the original outside walls of the house, thus the stucco finish. One of the walls (end wall) is constructed of concrete block with the stucco (concrete) finish. The other wall is built from wood studs and covered with concrete stucco. The stucco is a "bold" pattern and if I attach anything to it, I doubt if I could duplicate it when it's removed, should I ever (Heaven Forbid) move again.
Now that that's been said, what kinds of problems can I look forward to by building a "Free Standing" layout? Maybe if I know them in advance I can find a way to reduce their intensity. :?:

Wayne



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 Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 09:04 am
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Les
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Hi Wayne,

Below is a picture of my original track plan which had loops at either end to take the track just under the baseboards again and give continuous running. I have altered it now because I decided that the 1 in 40 inclines to get the trains underneath were too much for British scale length trains but the idea would have worked if I had not wanted to do this.

Copy original track plan attached.



You dont need to see the detail but it gives you some idea of the concept and could leave you whole window wall free.

I have now gone across the room building removable bridges for the door and windows although I guess you cant do that.

The other point is that I will never exhibit the layout therefore it is fixed and rests on battens fixed to the walls with legs on the outer parts, so Bob's suggestion of battens using No-nails could be a good one. :wink:

Les



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 Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 12:15 pm
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Perry
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Wayne Williams wrote:In regards to my "Free Standing" layout, two of the Interior walls of this room are the original outside walls of the house, thus the stucco finish. One of the walls (end wall) is constructed of concrete block with the stucco (concrete) finish. The other wall is built from wood studs and covered with concrete stucco. The stucco is a "bold" pattern and if I attach anything to it, I doubt if I could duplicate it when it's removed, should I ever (Heaven Forbid) move again.
Now that that's been said, what kinds of problems can I look forward to by building a "Free Standing" layout? Maybe if I know them in advance I can find a way to reduce their intensity. :?:

Wayne


My 'East Walsham' layout is free-standing, consisting of five separate baseboards, mostly with two pairs of legs each, When assembled, the layout is 'U'-shaped and I think this contributes greatly to it's stability. I made the legs plug in to the baseboard framing, doing away with hinges, bolts, etc. Even one baseboard standing alone is pretty stable, but it takes a hefty shove to move anything at all when it's all fitted together. The legs need adequate bracing and the joints need to be accurately made and glued and screwed together, rather than just nailed.

Another thing that contributes to the stability is the fitting of leg levellers. If one leg happens to have been cut a couple of millimetres short, the error can be adjusted out, making sure it all stands nice and firmly, regardless of how level or otherwise your floor is.

There are some pictures showing the legs units on the 'Personal Layout' section of this forum. Sorry it's not up to date yet, but I've been a little busy with other matters. :wink: :D

Perry



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 Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 12:36 pm
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Petermac
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Wayne - re the DC/DCC argument, I'm in exactly the same position as you. My understanding of DC is far and away greater than that of DCC and, as I'm not exactly made of money, cost is a very real consideration.

I know I SHOULD go for DCC but can I get my head around the complexities of it and can I actually afford it ?

Everyone seems to advise DCC but I'm still not totally convinced. Over this side of the pond, "DCC ready" locos are a fair bit more expensive than DC locos and with the added 10 sterling for the decoder, you're talking real money.

I do hope, before too long, someone will say "Petermac, stop bu....ing about and go DCC - it's the future" or Petermac, stay in your cave and stick with steam-radio. HELP !!!

Petermac



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 Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 04:34 pm
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Matt
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petermac
you can pick a basic hornby controler up for 30 40 quid :D plug it in and have a play. you can pick a loco up quite cheap from fleebay. 08 shunter 31 quid when i looked
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Hornby-R2419-Class-08-09-Diesel-Shunter-DCC-On-board_W0QQitemZ110182941073QQihZ001QQcategoryZ125452QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

i have picked them up new for 25 quid.
NEW HORNBY DIGITAL R8213 DCC SELECT CONTROLLER for 99p when i looked, these do go cheap
http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/NEW-HORNBY-DIGITAL-R8213-DCC-SELECT-CONTROLLER_W0QQitemZ330180353499QQihZ014QQcategoryZ125452QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

the good thing is you can select 00 on your controller and still run your dc loco.
i done some tests for rector on the old forum, i had a dc little giant and 3 dcc locos all on the same oval. all whizzing round at the same time. if i selected 00 i could ajust the speed of the dc loco then i could select one of the other locos and ajust the speed.
rector may be able to add to this as i am sure he has run dc on his dcc system or had a seperate track. hope this is a big enougth boot up the r&!$ $%*. :wink:

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 Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 06:24 pm
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Wayne Williams
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Well, here it is, the South Shore Line, soon to be stopping in Hudson, Florida. (I wish)



This sketch is the closest yet to being in scale, but it does still have several "artistic liberties" applied.
The dimensions scattered about indicate the height of the track from the shortest height baseboard (which is the left hand area). As you can see I really wanted a lot of space available for scenery. I intend to place most of the track on a 3" riser so I can model in ditches on both sides of the track. The dimensions you see that say zero, are the only areas that the track is setting on the baseboard.
The primary concept for this design was to be able to place all the track above the baseboard without cutting big holes in it to run one track under another one. Also this one gives me great access to all areas of the layout.
Lets see???? today is the 26th of October and I have decided to use DCC (Again). I will stay with this decision IF every person on this forum with DCC knowledge raises their right hand and swears "I WILL HELP WAYNE WITH HIS DCC WIRING". :D :D :D :D :D Actually I would have asked you to do the same thing if I choose DC :wink:

Perry,
Thanks for the info on the leg levelers, that's a great idea. I will use them, that's for sure. I also plan on putting in a bottom shelf for storage of, well everything that will fit. I think that will stabilize the layout quite a bit too.

Wayne



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 Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 06:31 pm
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rector
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I will help Wayne with his DCC wiring :!: :!: :!:

(Although I'm still on the learning curve myself, Wayne, so it may be a case of the blind leading the blind :? :? :? In which case there are many members poised in the wings ready to assist :D )

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 Posted: Fri Oct 26th, 2007 08:09 pm
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Petermac
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Matt - you may just have tipped the balance !!!

I realise that it's no good going backwards and, lets face it, at one time I didn't even know my positive from my negative so I've come a long way already. I wouldn't say I'm ready for space travel just yet but maybe, just maybe with everyones help, I could get what brain cells I have left, around the DCC system. Like Wayne, if everyone says "we'll help", here we go !!

Petermac



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