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00 Gauge - Tetleys Mills - Members Personal Layouts. - Model Railway Layouts. - Your Model Railway Club
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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 11:19 am
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MikeC
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It's only about $6.50 here for a block about oh I don't know maybe 6.5 ins long by 4 x1. I don't like the new DAS though. It's more like plastic than clay. You need the old DAS that looks like it's in a foil pack.

Mike

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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 04:22 pm
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Tetley
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Hi Guys,

 

 Mike C. has answered one of the questions posed and that is, PVA glue is used to prime the surface which, if it is card or most other surfaces it is fine but plastic card or another none absorbent surface becomes less successful. They will still take DAs but with no guarantee that thin layers will not be removed with scribing.

Also note. If using thin materials then prime BOTH SIDES because the glue introduces surface tension which can cause warping.

I have never experienced shrinkage (well not in my DAS but I am 59!)

I think most of the dressed stone/ smoother scribed surfaces have only 1mm or less covering of DAS, OK sometimes a small area may flake away but it is easy to replace and repeat the scribing. If I want a more textured surface ie semi-dressed stone I tend to mark the courses whilst wet and using a small screwdriver, (the cheap types with a clear plastic handle) I mark the perts or vertical joints. Another very useful tool for this and applying DAS into tight corners are dental probes, the sort with flat surfaces. Once it all dries I then fine tune each stone using a sharpened old screwdriver or a fine fettled screwdriver to clean up the joints whilst 'knocking off' some of the over raised detail. TOP TIP  I then brush the work lightly with a suede brush which not only cleans out the joints but takes the shine off the DAS and adds a slight riven finish.

Another point to make is that, do not attempt any of this at home UNLESS YOU HAVE DAS For a while I couldnt buy any and I bought a similar product marketed by Humbrol, it was not at all suitable having small fibres in the clay which may have added strength but prevented fine carving, I bined a whole pack.






A selection of the high tech equipment used at Tetleys Towers.

The plastic tube and wooden dowel are for smoothing out the DAS do not roll it but wet the tube and smear the DAS, you can get a consistant 1mm layer. dental probe as mentioned along with my home made scribes, the knife I use for removing Das from window openings and sperating the DAS from carboard formers when making pavements. The pavements are given a riven ripple effect using the spatular.




My wool warehouse has less than 1mm of DAS on cardboard and scribed as semi dressed stone.

 




The BZ is being shunted beneath the road bridge bisecting Tetleys Mills terminus, the bridge is covered in 7mm plasticard but the arch  stones are DAS individually shaped using my trusty dental probe and fine tuned once dry.




All the stone buildings with the exception of the jam factory visible in this shot towards the Barden Road branch are finished using DAS. Scribing doesn't take that long really though it can induce repetitive 'Train' syndrom.

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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 04:40 pm
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Alan
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My guess is that you have shares in Das :roll:

And after looking at your baseboards, I can see why they are so strong, your layout must be very heavy, but the finished detailing on the buildings is brilliant.

Can I ask, have you had lots of different camera's since you have built Tetley, as the quailty of the photo's varies a lot ?

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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 04:40 pm
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Petermac
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Thanks for the very informative "how to" Dave. :thumbs:thumbs

Am I right in thinking you allow the PVA primer (is it diluted and if so, by how much ?) to dry before applying the DAS ?

Do you then allow the DAS to dry before attacking with your scribes for "normal" dressed stone (I see you did say for deeper prifiled stone, you scribe whilst it's still soft).

Sorry to be a pain with all these questions but I am impressed with your results and would like to have a go myself !!  It's the sort of "dirty" architechture I love being an area I know so well and this is the best rendition of it that I ever remember seeing. :cheers



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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 05:51 pm
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Tetley
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This viaduct was my very first journey in to the unknown, the use of DAS. The inner walls are pieces of card covered in DAS, it is highly unlikely that this particular structure will be used in the new layout since it is way below par, I did not have the knowledge nor skill back then. The stonework is crude and note the lifted edges of stones formed by marking the wet DAS. These should have been knocked back during fettling and the stones shaped better it would be very destructive to replace this viaduct but compare it with my earlier images of my new viaduct on this post and the picture gallery.


.
I've managed to edit the post and slip this one in. This pub and the brewery on the upper right right are better examples of wet DAS scribed and fettled.





Not my intended upload but a shot of yet another pub although it does show the tunnel portal which is plywood covered in DAS and I've made a better job of the scribing on this job.

 


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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 05:56 pm
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henryparrot
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Dave

Reading your instructions re the Das clay you say you apply it to both sides of the card do you mean for example the buildings you have internally have a rough 1 mm coating of Das on the inside aswell as the scribed and brushed coating on the outside?

 

also do you have a rough working time with the Das for example would you tackle a 12inch square area in 1 go or more or less obviously shape and detail would come into this.

cheers Brian

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 Posted: Tue Oct 20th, 2009 06:35 pm
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Tetley
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henryparrot wrote: Dave

Reading your instructions re the Das clay you say you apply it to both sides of the card do you mean for example the buildings you have internally have a rough 1 mm coating of Das on the inside aswell as the scribed and brushed coating on the outside?

 

cheers Brian


Brian.

 

Sorry for my confusing instructions.

Apply PVA to both sides of card to equalise the surface tension.  You only need to then apply DAS to the surface that will be showing. Unless the atposphere is hot and dry ie Oz or elsewhere with a sunny climate I would be happy to work a reasonablel large area because all you have to do initally is to scribe horizontal bed courses using a clear ruler suspended slightly above the surface to avoid it sticking then work along and add the vertical joints. You can releive boredom by adding larger key stones and alternating the sizes of bed course to correspond with the stone thickness coming out of the quarry. This prototypical.

Once all that is done leave it to dry thoroughly you can place it near a radiator or as I do even near an open fire if it warps a little you'll probably stick it down flat using impact adhesive anyway. You can re-scribe and fettle at your own pace then.

I suggest you start on a small job and work up to tower blocks or Ribblehead Viaduct.

 

Good Luck

 

Dave

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 Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 12:55 pm
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Tetley
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Alan wrote: My guess is that you have shares in Das :roll:

And after looking at your baseboards, I can see why they are so strong, your layout must be very heavy, but the finished detailing on the buildings is brilliant.

Can I ask, have you had lots of different camera's since you have built Tetley, as the quailty of the photo's varies a lot ?


Alan,

I've no shares just a very satisfied customer.

The baseboards are normal open frame with 9mm ply where required but the support timbers are up to 3"x 2" and cross supports 3"x 1" it is on the ground floor and the timber was off cuts re-sized from various timbers left after I built the garden room.

I accept the quality of the images varies but they are all taken with the same dog cheapo camera which was a free gift after completing a 'Learn Direct' computing course, (I suspect the Government sponsered it in an attempt to get lazy layabouts like me back into gainful employement and pay more taxes, but I'm in receipt of a decent pension so I remain a lazy layabout)

It only has 2.1 M.Pixels. I don't use flash which burns out the scene so it is iether daylight or my 60w table lamp which I may supplement with my low energy flourescent work lamp and I even tried 300w buildeing lamps which I admit were a tad too OTT.

I have a tripod but no remote activation shutter cable  hence the camera shake. 

Although attending a couple of week long photography courses during my emplyment days as [art of my work I have little interest in the subject. I keep thinking I should spend some money on a decent new camera then I ask myself "why, nobody is interested in your holiday snaps and you no longer need photography for my work?"

If I appear in magazines they always send a professional snapper with at least a 100w table lamp for lighting and a camera with more than 2.1 mp.

I accept my images are c--p but they give a general feel for what I'm doing.

 

Dave (Not David Bailey)

 

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 Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 01:01 pm
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Gwiwer
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I certainly wouldn't describe those images as "c@@p". They are perfectly good.

Model railways seem to be notoriously difficult to photograph well which is probably a factor of them often being in low light and requiring a slow shutter (slower still when no flash is used) yet also requiring a huge depth of focus. Those two are not quite mutually exclusive but are not easy to obtain with most cameras.

The latest DSLR cameras which can mimic ISO to about 3200 will give great results but you need a new mortgage in order to own one.

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 Posted: Wed Oct 21st, 2009 05:22 pm
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Tetley
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I've discovered a new vantage point for photographs so here's a selection





I've been experimenting with time delay on my camera which gives me a few seconds to position my hand held table lamp. A new Class 37 (or whatever they were called back in the early sixties) recently issued to Hull is on a stopping passenger / parcels train from it's home station to Bradford Exchange.

 




 

A few seconds later and the same train is met by a mixed goods hauled by the West Riding's work horse, a Riddles Austerity. Those allocated to the Western Region of course, had to differ from everywhere else and they were fitted with a fire iron tunnel alongside the boiler. Other regions and certainly the Eastern and North Eastern fitted brackets and a plated in section on the tender side to hold the fire irons. Bachmann do not include this vital component so I have added it, rust quickly formed as the fire irons knocked any paint off and streaks of rust alway ran down the tender sides. Rust also formed in the tender bunker from the acids in the coal and the constant damage caused from the coal that fell thirty or forty feet from coaling hoppers. You cannot over weather an Austerity and they look all the better for it.




Same afternoon, same camera and this image has a blue tinge which, I'm sure the experts can explain but I'm sure it is down to the lighting, I'm not losing sleep over it however.

I had to balance on the viaduct parapet over the canal basin which was not included in my track pass to get this shot of my last building made for the re-built area, it appears the three storey house may have originally been a weaver's residence judging by the gallery of workshop windows to maximise light in what was probably a dark location.

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 Posted: Thu Oct 22nd, 2009 08:48 am
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Alan
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Tetley wrote:

Can I ask, have you had lots of different camera's since you have built Tetley, as the quailty of the photo's varies a lot ?


Alan,


I accept my images are c--p but they give a general feel for what I'm doing.

 
Dave (Not David Bailey)
 


Morning Dave ( Bailey) ;-)

In no way was I saying that your photographs were C..P, but after you post above it has all come to light !, and then you went out and tried a few more yesterday with excellent results, you might find this thread of some interest to you.

http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=2931&forum_id=24

My guess at the reason of the light being bluer on your last image, is that you didn't use you desklight for fill-in, and the outside light that comes in from your windows or large doors, at this time of the year is a colder blue colour, compared with a yellow light in the middle of summer, just look at the colour of shadows to see the real colour of the light at different times of the year.

If I can be of any help, just ask.

But don't stop adding images or your " how I did it" post, but it might be a good idea if you started a thread just showing how you build and finish your buildings as not all our members will have read this thread :thumbs

Really like the second image with the Class 37, just the right angle/level, spot on :thumbs

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 Posted: Thu Oct 22nd, 2009 09:35 am
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Tetley
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Alan wrote: Tetley wrote:

Can I ask, have you had lots of different camera's since you have built Tetley, as the quailty of the photo's varies a lot ?


Alan,


I accept my images are c--p but they give a general feel for what I'm doing.

 
Dave (Not David Bailey)
 




In no way was I saying that your photographs were C..P, but after you post above it has all come to light !, and then you went out and tried a few more yesterday with excellent results, you might find this thread of some interest to you.

Alan,

Don't worry I said my photographs were c--p or at least some of them, I certainly didn't take any of your comments in a negative way and I certainly didn't read your original reply in that way. You are quite right about starting a new post on the 'How I do my buildings' bit. I'm also greatful for your explanation on lighting, my photography courses involved roll film and were shot outdoors or usually in the dead of night in a force 8 with driving rain surrounded by carnage, whilst I used milti- flash etc I was more interested in getting the job done and getting warm and dry than the finer points of lighting.

If any of the clever people in the forum can transfer those particular posts into a seperate category I'll be quite happy to add to it in the future

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 Posted: Thu Oct 22nd, 2009 10:01 am
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phill
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Just caught up on this brilliant layout. So real and those buildings are amazingly life like. I think i am right in you sayoing it was to be dismantled or am i wrong? If i am right why are you going to do this?.

Your pics are really good and i am also impresed on the way you build things, something i wi be trying to do soon.

Thanks for a great thread, more to come i hope and i am right you was in Hornby mag and i have just re read it, brilliant mate, brilliant. :Happy:cheers

Phill

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 Posted: Thu Oct 22nd, 2009 10:36 am
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Tetley
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Phill,

 

 I'm glad you like it.

I've never been in Hornby Mag but this layout and a previous version have featured in the very first Model Rail and several issues since. There have also been a few DVD's featuring it.  It is soon to feature in BRM with photographs by Tony Wright, thankfully not me.

I am currently locked in mortal combat with my local planning department, we have sufficient land to build eight modern houses (ie no garden and not much else) but the current Mrs. Shakespeare and I want to build a single retirement home in our rear garden which will include a proper sized double garage above which will be a large  7.1 x 5.5 bedroom. This will become my railway room. The current Tetleys Mills is approximately 3m x 7m and it would be impossible to dismantle the basebaords although all the buildings and structures were built removeable so I will build a completetly new layout but it will include most of the current buildings but not necessariliy in their current grouping.

Our planning application is in the appeal process so I will know by Christmas what I'll be doing in 2010.

 

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 Posted: Thu Oct 22nd, 2009 03:56 pm
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phill
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Sorry Dave i have loads of Rail mags and also others so must of been in one of those i read it, my mistake. I normally just pick them up to re-read and neve look who it is by, :oops:. So must of been the mag you said. I recall you slightly altered a area for some reason and explaine how you did it and why?.

Sounds like you have a huge back garden mate :thud. Deffinetly read it thou.

Phill

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 Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 06:38 pm
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Tetley
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I've been without my internet connection for a few days but since I'm back in touch with the world I'll add a few more images I've un-earthed.




The main street at Tetleys Mills showing one of t'mills as a backdrop.




The same mill receiving a delivery of Australian wool which had been stored in the railway wool warehouse.




Those pesky Scammels get everywhere (but they are lovely and very 1950s railway transport)




I detect a dog fight about to happen .

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 Posted: Thu Oct 29th, 2009 07:16 pm
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Tetley
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A highly trained pigeon took this image on his approach run to a roof top landing




 A slightly lower angle, this building was inspired by Bradford Forster Sq. Goods Office although the roof dome has been somewhat simplified.




The entrance to tetleys Mills terminus has been enhanced by a Townstreet portico which Jim Hendry based on that at Louth station Lincolnshire my wife Julie's home town.

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 Posted: Mon Nov 9th, 2009 07:44 am
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ElDavo
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Truly atmospheric stuff. The buildings and seemingly haphazard positioning really capture the feel of the mill towns. Great stuff.

Cheers
Dave

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 Posted: Thu Nov 19th, 2009 03:43 pm
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Petermac
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Dave - in this photo there is a model of a Triumph Roadster - the red sports car.

As I had one in my youth, I thought it might be a good idea to re-live those days on my layout.  If you can remember, who makes it and where did you get it ?  I've probably said it before but I'll say it again - great shot. :thumbs




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 Posted: Thu Nov 19th, 2009 04:22 pm
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Tetley
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Petermac,

I've just upended the Triumph and it says EFE which I'd assume is Exclusive First Editions, I'm sure it didn't cost much unlike some previous kits bought out of desperation for some vehicles on the layout. I've no special affinity so it may have been in a group of vehicles possibly even Cararama but it was a few years ago.

Im sure Oxford Diecasts will be bringing one out shortly but if you cannot source a roadster and you really want one get back to me and we may be able to do a swap.

 

Dave

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