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00 Gauge - Bear's End - Members Personal Layouts. - Model Railway Layouts. - Your Model Railway Club
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 Posted: Sat Dec 20th, 2008 04:42 pm
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Chubber
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Hullo All,

I've started this thread to introduce my long-held ambition to have a train set, which I hope to base on a rather unusual premise, that WWII didn't happen. No War Duties, no British Rail, no common user, no decline following the straightened circumstances that pertained following 1945.  Set in the West of England it will hopefully reflect the GWR, and will consist of the ubiquitous branch terminus, with a little industry, an oil fuel/bitumen/coal depot and one or two other bits and pieces. Below are the first pictures of my attempt at a traverser in build, cut into what will be the right-hand end base board.  The boards are built up with 4" 'I' beam sides.













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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

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 Posted: Sat Dec 20th, 2008 04:53 pm
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MaxSouthOz
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neat work, dd



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 Posted: Sat Dec 20th, 2008 05:54 pm
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Gwent Rail
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I'll be watching this one with interest, Doug. I'm already intrigued by that traverser.

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 Posted: Mon Dec 22nd, 2008 05:06 pm
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Chubber
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Progress on the traverser.




I've chosen to motorise it, and will worry about the control/indexing later. 

I've sweated a piece of brass pipe to a length of 6mm threaded stock, bored out a brass plumbing fitting to suit the o.d. of the brass tube and mounted the fitting in a marine ply bracket, which will be screwed to the underside of the base board.

Nyloc nuts and washers either side of the brass fitting will hold washers and a plywood pulley in place and form thrust bearings, permitting the pulley to be driven by a Lego  electric motor fitted with a very small pulley.

The other end of the threaded rod will engage in a 6mm nut soldered to a pair of washers which will be fixed to the underside of the traverser table.  As the rod turns, the action of the threaded rod and the captive  nut should move the traverser table.

[Insert praying smiley....]

Sadly, domestic duties prevented any modelling today....:roll::roll:




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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Mon Dec 22nd, 2008 05:12 pm
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georgejacksongenius
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Keep it coming,Doug.I'm not sure wether I might try one of these traverser jobbies for my Perranporth layout.
   I'll be watching with interest.

Cheers,John.B.

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 Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 01:06 pm
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Chubber
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The 'Great Train Lifter' of the YMR it certainly ain't, but I'm chuffed because it seems to work.  After starting out with a hi-tech Lego worm reduction to drive the pulley, I was surprised to find a simple elastic band drive worked best!

Pctures below, including one of it moving my Ryobi hammer drill, weighing just under 4lbs, with no problem.

Controlling it will be the challenge, of course!!








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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 01:35 pm
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Robert
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Now this looks to be too simple to be true Doug but it works.



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 Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 04:10 pm
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MaxSouthOz
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controlling it will be the easy part.  Sol's your man.  He has electrons coming out of his . . . er . . . ear?



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 Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 05:15 pm
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Sol
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MaxSouthOz wrote: controlling it will be the easy part.  Sol's your man.  He has electrons coming out of his . . . er . . . ear?

Thanks for the lift to my ego Max, but no, there are plenty of circuits around for controlling traversers & turntables.

Not sure how the rubber band will stop the unit dead when motor stops unless one drives the motor with a normal analogue control so the operator can creep up on to the actual stop like driving a loco.

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 Posted: Tue Dec 23rd, 2008 11:59 pm
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phill
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Following with much interest.

Phill



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 Posted: Wed Dec 24th, 2008 06:11 am
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Alan
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This looks brilliant, looking forward to watching this.

But it is way over my head, guess that means lots to learn :pathead

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 Posted: Wed Dec 24th, 2008 10:12 am
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Dukedog
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An intersting idea! the like of which I have thought about for some time for use on Pen Y Bont.
I have some 8mm "all thread" that I thought about using and originally thought about manual operation as per a workshop vice.
I have a small geared 12V motor a little bigger than the lego one you are using and thanks to you it lokks like it would have the nesscesary power.

Thing is if anything failed during an exhibition (rubber band snapped!) then it would be a bit awkward to say the least.
Anyway, I'll keep an eye on this to see how you get on first.

My thoughts on indexing, I was thinking of reed switches fixed to the non moving bit with magnets mounted on the traverser. I'm sure with a bit of relay or TTL logic a control system could be easilly divised to run it.

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 Posted: Wed Dec 24th, 2008 11:32 am
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Chubber
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Dukedog wrote: An intersting idea! the like of which I have thought about for some time for use on Pen Y Bont.
I have some 8mm "all thread" that I thought about using and originally thought about manual operation as per a workshop vice.
I have a small geared 12V motor a little bigger than the lego one you are using and thanks to you it lokks like it would have the nesscesary power.

Thing is if anything failed during an exhibition (rubber band snapped!) then it would be a bit awkward to say the least.
Anyway, I'll keep an eye on this to see how you get on first.

My thoughts on indexing, I was thinking of reed switches fixed to the non moving bit with magnets mounted on the traverser. I'm sure with a bit of relay or TTL logic a control system could be easilly divised to run it.




Re the snapped rubber band scenario, if you look at my piccies you'll see thet the free end of my threaded rod is very close to the side of the base board. My intention is to drill a hole in the side of the board [easy with 'I' beam construction] so as to be able to turn the threaded rod with a nut-driver applied to a lock-nut set on the end of the rod, using a battery drill-driver.



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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Sun Dec 28th, 2008 01:06 pm
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georgejacksongenius
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Doug,
       Have you got a track-plan for your layout yet....or a name???

Cheers,John.B.

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 Posted: Mon Dec 29th, 2008 07:34 am
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Chubber
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Well, the original idea didn't work out.............

There is enough play in the drawer slides to prevent the table lining up exactly with the entry track, it slops from side to side by about 1.5 mm. I have tried little tin-plate springs, ball catches and all sorts to no avail, as I can not get an alignment that is consistently good enough.

See diagram below [one picture is worth a thousand seconds wasted on XtrkCad]



Noticing that the table assumes a positive repeatable alignment at each limit of travel when it reaches the edges, I reasoned that a pair of adjustable stops at each side would provide accurate adjustment, but left the centre position still flopping about by 1.5 mm. Only having two traverser tracks is a no-no, as a loco could not run-round a train to pick up another, so I've decided to try a turnout leading to the traverser, as in the diagram below. In this scenario, only two pairs of stops are needed to allow three roads to be accessed. Further more.........at the limit of travel in each direction, the inbuilt 'inertia sensing auto drive-limiter' cuts in [the drive belt starts to slip...] indicating exactly the moment to release the button!




So, a new idea, just got to see if I can make it work...............



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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Mon Dec 29th, 2008 07:38 am
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Chubber
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georgejacksongenius wrote: Doug,
       Have you got a track-plan for your layout yet....or a name???

Cheers,John.B.


Well, John, I did have a plan when I posted here under 'Dooferdog's railway', but that was before SWMBO came up with the idea of moving up from the cellar to the corner spare bedroom!

I think it will be called 'Bear's End', a polite version of the family expression meaning 'a terrible mess'!



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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Mon Dec 29th, 2008 03:02 pm
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Sol
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Doug, I like that:-

the inbuilt 'inertia sensing auto drive-limiter'     :pathead. I hope you have applied for a world-wide patent :question

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 Posted: Mon Dec 29th, 2008 09:46 pm
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Gwiwer
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Seems like we have a bad case of "too simple to be true - but it is" :Happy

Nice work so far and you have another watcher here keen to see how things develop.

Although I have a fixed yard with lots of running space there may come a time when I need something just like this for a future project.

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 Posted: Tue Dec 30th, 2008 01:50 pm
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Gwent Rail
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Doug, you've got me wondering now. I recently reported my intention to extend the Western Valley Railway into a roundy-roundy, which would involve a lift out section as a fiddle yard. maybe a lift out traverser would give more potential and be easier.

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 Posted: Fri Jan 2nd, 2009 03:21 am
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phill
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Watching with great interest mate.

Phill



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 Posted: Fri Jan 2nd, 2009 01:40 pm
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Lawrence
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Doug, the Dec 08 edition of model railroader has an article on an extremely similar item, but used for changing hauls on a train.  From what I can see from your diagrams and what they have published, the outer tracks taper outwards to the edge of the panel, this sorts out the alignment issue.  Obviously I can't post the images on here so, if you can't get a copy pm me your address and I'll photocopy the relevant stuff and send it down

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 Posted: Fri Jan 2nd, 2009 03:39 pm
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Chubber
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Thanks, Lawrence, I have pm'd you!



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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Fri Jan 16th, 2009 12:15 pm
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Chubber
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Having had a break from the cellar during the colder weather I set to Wednesday and took it all apart, increased all the clearances, stuck some cork down on the table and made up some cams by cutting out 4 circles of laminate flooring with a small tank cutter, soldered up some curved extensions to a Peco turnout and today played around until it all seems to work. In the photographs, the rails are held down with drawing pins during the trial. I'll go round now and replace all the 3.5 x 20 mm screws in the construction with 4 x 25 mm, add some fillets of PVA here and there, lay cork at both ends where needed and fix down my first piece  of track that leads off of the traverser.......:Happy










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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Fri Jan 16th, 2009 12:55 pm
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georgejacksongenius
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Now you've got your track coming off your traverser the fun can begin!!!(Lets see some trains!!!;-))

:doublethumb
Cheers,John.B.

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 Posted: Fri Jan 16th, 2009 01:11 pm
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henryparrot
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Looking good Doug

are you going to use the screw with the raill soldered to it for positioning or just fix the rail as is in place?

cheers Brian

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 Posted: Fri Jan 16th, 2009 01:18 pm
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Chubber
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I think I will just stick it with PVA. I have yet to bring it all up from the cellar to a bedroom where it might dry out a bit and twist/warp so nothing will be 'set in stone' yet. I want to do the messy bits downstairs!

Besides, I have to sell a complete pine cottage bedroom suite before I get in there....



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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Fri Jan 16th, 2009 01:23 pm
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henryparrot
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Doug

just chop it all up to use with the scenery:mutley:mutley:mutley

cheers Brian

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 Posted: Mon Feb 16th, 2009 04:02 pm
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Chubber
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One of the trickier bits of installing point motors IMHO is keeping the motor in 'mid-position' whilst marking and drilling the fitting screw holes. Suggestions include cutting a little piece of slotted card to slip over the actuating arm, making a blank pattern of the base plate and so on. The card drops out. The pattern doesn't have a pin sticking up in the right place for an 'eyeball' test.............aaaarrgh!

So, I have altered one of SWMBO's clothes pegs by turning it inside out and cutting two differing sized slots in the 'handle' end of the peg to slide around the spring on one side of the moving part and the actuating arm on the other, see below. It keeps the actuator in mid position and doesnt drop off onto the floor. TaDaaaaaa!  I've decided that pushing two bits of card either side of the moving rails to centre them works best for me.








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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Mon Feb 16th, 2009 04:10 pm
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owen69
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who is a clever boy then, neat trick where were you when i did my
37 point motors then????

:doublethumb:mutley:mutley:mutley:cool:

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 Posted: Mon Feb 16th, 2009 04:15 pm
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Christrerise
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Brilliant!  Quite a handy way of holding on when soldering as well!

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 Posted: Mon Feb 16th, 2009 05:20 pm
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Robert
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Ingenuity eh, this forum has more than it's fair share.
Can somebody give me an explanatory name for this tip as I want to put it in the Index?



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 Posted: Mon Feb 16th, 2009 05:32 pm
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henryparrot
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Seep point setting gauge

cheers Brian

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 Posted: Mon Feb 16th, 2009 05:48 pm
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Robert
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Seen to that. We also have another method by a member, posted back in 2007 which I had forgotten about. Should try looking in my own Index.



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 Posted: Mon Feb 16th, 2009 06:03 pm
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Gwent Rail
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:It's a no no:It's a no no:It's a no no Tut, Tut, Mr FC  :cool wink:cool wink:cool wink

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 Posted: Mon Feb 16th, 2009 06:18 pm
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Yeah, yeah, I know.



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 Posted: Tue Feb 17th, 2009 03:40 am
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Chubber
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Owen - 37 point motors then????


AAAaaarrgh.........runs screaming from workshop:shock::shock::shock:



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"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Thu Feb 19th, 2009 02:39 pm
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Chubber
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As promised- a picture of the new motor, £4.65 in maplins, Basingstoke.  It is rated 6-15 volts, and has plenty of torque, so I have done away with the pulley that was on the Lego motor and run the band [which incidentally is a nitrile rubber driving band from Lego, not just a bog-standard 'laccy-band'] directly round the motor shaft. At 6 volts it takes about  15 seconds to make the trip from one side to the other, and the 'inertia sensing auto drive-limiter' [slipping belt] comes into play just 'bootiful' when the traverser hits the stops.




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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Thu Feb 19th, 2009 03:18 pm
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Chubber
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Now....for some Bob Heath-style money saving bits and pieces!:lol:

I have decided to use 1.5 sq/mm blue sheathed cable* as my '0 Volts' return busbar.

* I've got loads of it...

This is pretty chunky stuff compared with the telephone cable [story about that later] that I intend to use as connections to and from individual switches and components, so is a no-no for most connectors.

I want to be able to work on any of my three base boards separately, so do not want to 'join' them together by a hulking great 0 volt bus bar and have chosen to link each board to the next by means of a 'self aligning auto-expansive juxtaposing facility' [spring-loaded contacts].

So, be prepared to be bored rigid by the pictures below of.....

A brass drawing pin soldered to a piece of wire around which is placed a spring, won from an old computer printer, and a washer..........



In the side of the base board frames I've drilled a hole big enough to let the wire slide back and forward, yet too small to let the washer pass though so that the drawing pin sits on one side exactly like a spring buffer assembly.

The 'clip', below......is taken off and soldered on the stripped piece of wire to hold the drawing pin just proud of the mating surfaces of the base boards



once the wire has been threaded through one side member like this....






the drawing pin presses against another on the mating base board, which is slightly recessed so as not to prevent them taking up their proper alignment [remember the 'Earwig'?]





Once the boards are bolted together, the sprung drawing pin presses firmly against the unsprung drawing pin, which is locked in place with a similar hairpin type clip.

Finally, to hold the bus bar up under the board, other drawing pins and a dab of solder are used to hold it up out of the way.



Lots of pennies saved for more Scottish Laughing Water [SLW] :thumbs:thumbs






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'You may share the labours of the great, but you will not share the spoil...' Aesop's Fables

"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Thu Feb 19th, 2009 03:33 pm
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Sol
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Doug, you certainly won't be getting the "Dunces" hat coming up with those ideas.
Do I assume that the hole for the washer/spring combination does not go all the way through the timber- but just a small hole for the wire all the way? Because in the 3rd photo showing the soldered clip, I cannot see the washer.

Ideal for Gwent Rail's lift out modules especially if he went DCC - just need 2 of the  'self aligning auto-expansive juxtaposing facilities'

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 Posted: Thu Feb 19th, 2009 04:14 pm
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Robert
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Another one for the Index but I need a suitable explanatory name, which eludes me for the moment.



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 Posted: Thu Feb 19th, 2009 04:15 pm
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That's right, Sol, on the 'sprung' side the only 'through' hole is the one that allows the wire to pass through the wood. The washer bears against the bottom of a bigger hole drilled afterwards [he engineering term is counterbored], so, there is a 4mm hole right through for the wire, into which a 3/8ths hole has been drilled to accept the spring and washer, drilled deeply enough to leave the expanded spring and drawing pin proud of the surface by about 1/8". The mating drawing pin on the other side is just recessed in a 1/2" hole formed by a flat bit.

If that's not clear I'll do a diagram....?

Sorry about the mixed units, but those were the sizes used!



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Chubber
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'Electrics-home-made sprung contacts between baseboards' perhaps, if it's not too long?


Comme ca.....




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 Posted: Thu Feb 19th, 2009 05:28 pm
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Sol
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dooferdog wrote: 'Electrics-home-made sprung contacts between baseboards' perhaps, if it's not too long?


Comme ca.....




Perfect drawing Doug. that explains it very well indeed.

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henryparrot
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Auto connecting bus wiring

Very good Doug just shows with a bit of thought one can can up with a answer to a problem which costs very little money well done

cheers Brian

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Chubber
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Hullo, everyone,

Thank you for your kind remarks, I'm in need of some advice, please.......:question:question

I was hoping to feed the tracks through the LH turnout , switching the +ve supply by means of the turnout, however.............



I have modified the Peco 75 turnout as per the maker's instructions, cutting the two links and joining the frog supply to the Seep changeover switch.

I have wired my traverser and approach line rails as shown, with B,D, F connected to a common point. 

Prior to connecting B,D,F in common, my loco would happily puff up to the traverser on both approaches, now it won't because B and C  are at the same potential when the turnout is thrown and the powr supply gets all upset.:shock:

I think I need to put some isolating joiners somewhere, possibly at the ends of the green lines marked '?' but for the life of me can't figure out how/why/where.

Can anyone help? I've probably got my head into a knot, I should know the answer myself, for heavens sake, I've worked with far more technical things that this before but????

My previous [limited]experience has all been with unmodified turnouts, I always left track-wiring to the others!:sad:



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 Posted: Sat Feb 21st, 2009 02:53 pm
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87 101
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I think reading your post that you have linked both sides of the frog creating a live frog turnout. The short is due to the point blades linking both rails electricaly when the point is set to diverge. Normaly you would use insulated rail joiners as you have said where the green lines are. I have similar problems with the station approch in my garage. ;-)

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 Posted: Sat Feb 21st, 2009 04:55 pm
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Chubber
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That makes sense, Dave but then how do you get the power to the rail the other side of the frog, a jumper?



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 Posted: Sat Feb 21st, 2009 07:00 pm
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Sol
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Doug, code 75 electrofrog points do not have to be modified for DC unless back to back measurements on locos are NBG.DCC is something different & I will create a new topic under DCC.
Frog switching does help with blade to stock rail contact problems & normally the tracks you have shown get power only when the point is set to the appropriate track.
Now because you do have B permanently connected to D, you will get a short circuit. The traverser tracks A.C & E, how do they get power? Once I know that, then I can help further.

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 Posted: Sun Feb 22nd, 2009 04:18 am
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Chubber
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Hullo, Sol, Is it tomorrow already today there?

I can't get my head round this time zone thing, I'm looking forward to my Sunday lunch, am I right in thinking you had yours 12 hours ago?

Well, back to the electrics, I was hoping that A,C, & E would get their power from the +ve switched through the turnout. I suppose that if I un-soldered the turnout and replaced it with an unmodified one, all would be well.....I don't want to do that though, because I thought making the modification gave better slow running over the turnout.  I have 'batch' altered half of them already, have I wasted my time?



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 Posted: Sun Feb 22nd, 2009 04:59 am
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87 101
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Looking at the plan again im asuming that you are using DC control. An easy solution is to fit two insulating joiners at the points marked green. The frog polarity switching is done via the point motor blades so ignore that for the time being. Remove any wiring to the switch contacts on the point motor. Then connect a wire from the positive rail aproching the point to the common on the point motor switch. You now need to create an isolating section on rail A otherwise it will be live all the time. Once done simply connect rails A & C to either side of the point motor switch. This will now give you the switching of the +ve supply that you wanted. As there is only one set of switching contacts on the seep motors on my layout I use them to switch relays giving me more switching options. By using a DPCO relay you would still be able to switch the frog as well as the +ve supply 

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 Posted: Sun Feb 22nd, 2009 05:43 am
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Sol
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Yes Doug, the way Dave suggests is one way.
As per your drawing, normally A & D are OK as it & it is B & C which gets power from the frog but with a traverser that moves around, either you have sliding contacts so that the traverser tracks gets the power from the fixed tracks or you hard wire them to the +ve & -ve via isolate switches. If they are sliding contacts, remove -ve from B, D & F & let the frog feed the correct power to the sliding contact but in this case, you will not need insulators at the frog.
Your drawing is not clear in how you physically get power to the traverser tracks. A photo or two will help.

Don't forget that I am about 8-9 hours ahead of you. As I write this, it is 9.15PM Sunday night.

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 Posted: Wed Mar 4th, 2009 12:03 pm
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Chubber
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Hullo,

Haven't been doing much modelling lately, seem to have had one of those 'not feeling inspired' periods, plus trying to get one or two other things done.

Still struggling with the wiring for my traverser, have devised a system of contacts that seems to work, piccy below. Doesn't close-up photography show up one's rotten soldering?  Temporary wiring inplace to try it out.

I'm glad to say the old fingers are starting to work again, thank goodness, and with a new bit in my 60 Watt iron things are much easier.

Anyway, herewith, Doofer's Tack and Tin Cheapskate Contacts!

Sorry, edited to say thanks for the advice above.






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87 101
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Looks intresting! :thumbs

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Sol
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As long as it works Doof, that is the important thing, prettiness can come later.

Ron

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Chubber
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Well, a week gone by and 'Plan A' didn't work out, so switch to 'Plan B', below. This was a bit more successful, but the tin-plate wiper contacts lost their springiness after 4 or 5 movements, so they are coming off whilst I ponder 'Plan C'.

Plan C will be  two rows of contacts which will mate with a travelling set on either side of the travel limits.

Vesti la Giubba!




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Robert
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If at first, etc, etc. Have no fear Doug, you will get there in the end, and just think of all that experience of the things that don't work. Invaluable. :lol:



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Sol
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Doug, it seems that there are no restrictions to your ingenuity. :thumbs

 After the traverser has been moved 1,000,000 times without fail, then apply for the Doofer Patent. :cool:

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Chubber
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Thanks for the encouragement, I am SOOOOOO longing to get on with the scenery and buildings!



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rjr
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They say Thomas Eddison on his 2000th attempt got the light bulb to work, he commented " I didnt fail 1999 times, just discovered 1999 ways to not do it"

I dont think plan A and B were wrong perhaps you just need some "springyer" metal. I found that the small wire that holds the plastic end caps on a fluerscent light diffuser is excellent spring steel for making reusable contacts.

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 Posted: Sat Mar 14th, 2009 03:55 am
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Chubber
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Thanks for that John, I'll visit the tip and have a hunt round, hadn't thought of that, lets hope it will take solder succesfully.

Doug.



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rjr
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I used pieces of for my cassettes I soldered it to the outside faces of the fixed rails with no problems, then bent it in slightly to make contact on the outside faces of the cassette rails.





Or another idea I have seen used is a surface mounted barrel bolt



Mount the bolt on the fixed side and 3 "keeps" on the traverser. If you get a braas barrel you can solder a feed to it then, solder each of the traverser tracks to the relevant keep. That gives you posotive location for the traverser and feed to the selected track. Only one rail needs to be fed via the barrel as the other rail can be linked and fed via a flexible cable to the feed rail.

Just realised the traverser is fed by more than one feed track, but Im sure a combination of barrels could sort that out.

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 Posted: Sat Mar 14th, 2009 01:20 pm
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Chubber
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That all looks good, John.

Just realised the traverser is fed by more than one feed track, but Im sure a combination of barrels could sort that out.

Therein lies the complication! The turn out alternates the polarity of the frog, and hence the adjacent track......

so, two sets of contacts it will have to be.

Disaster.......last night whilst removing the little contacts, I inadvertently soldered two tracks together, one on the traverser table, and one on the dead end. Having tipped up the boards to work from the underside, I traversed the table, only to  hear a tearing sound as the traverser ripped one of the dead end rails from the sleepers....:shock::shock:

Still. hey ho, worse things happen at sea, and SWMBO broke one of the tiles on the BBQ deck today as well......but tonight it's Corned Beef Hash with onions in the bottom, baked beans and my last can of UK Guiness.....:thumbs:thumbs:thumbs



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Chubber
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IT WORKS.............It ain't pretty, but two into three does go, after lots of messing about with home made switches etc, I went back to the first idea of contacts that move with the table.

Each end of the traverser trackage is looking pretty sorry for itself after all the soldering/unsoldering, and though it has worked throughout an hour of playing 'shunting puzzles' I'm not sure. Plus, I've lost the little lift up tension lock hook from the stern of my 45xx, it seems to have pinged out some where.

Herewith, some piccies of the prototype wiring, I can move side to side, uncouple, using plastic strips, swap locos from train to train and end to end etc. Now I must try and repair the damage to the track ends, perhaps cut out and insert a new bit in the middle of each traverser track and re-trim the part where they meet the fixed ends......perhaps, maybe.....








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MaxSouthOz
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It is actually quite pretty, dd.  Dumb question from me, "Why so many rail contacts?" - or are you using DC?  Told you it was a dumb question . . .



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Sol
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Doof, while it looks a bit "Heath Robinson", it looks a good working unit & by the time all is tidied up, you should be very proud of it.

An article for Model Rail then:question


( Of course DCC would make it easier :mutley)

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henryparrot
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Well done Doug

I know this has caused you a lot of hustle but now you have it working you must feel really chuffed what it looks like does not matter as long as it works.

cheers Brian

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Chubber
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MaxSouthOz wrote: It is actually quite pretty, dd.  Dumb question from me, "Why so many rail contacts?" - or are you using DC?  Told you it was a dumb question . . . Hi, Max,

There are so many contacts because each individual rail of  traverser track 1 and 2 have to be connected in the 'left' position with each individual rail of the two approach pair of tracks, and then in the 'right' position each individual rail of traverser track 2 and 3 have to be connected to the two approach pair of tracks. O.K? Are you still with me, pay attention, you asked for this....and no sniggering at the back.............:shock:

Now it gets complicated!  Remember, the four rails of the two tracks approaching the alternating traverser rails will be polarised by the point switching to

+........- , -.........-  in the straight-on position, and +......+, +......- in the turned-out position so there can be no 'common' rail connections.

What has been occupying my time has been

1    An attempt to make 'tin' contacts fitted to the ends of the rails to carry the point-switched current,

2   and several wasted attempts to design a switch unit to do the job of the contacts in absence of suitable phosphor-bronze spring material for the contacts.

Now I've done it 'in the rough', I'm still not satisfied and I'm wearing my thinking cap again.

Still, I did have a couple of hours of 'playing trains' last night! :doublethumb



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 Posted: Thu Mar 26th, 2009 06:23 am
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I think I'm getting a headache, Doug.  So it's a DC layout, by the sounds of it . . .



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 Posted: Thu Mar 26th, 2009 06:33 am
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Yup, just plain ole' D.C.  [Damn & Curse it...]



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owen69
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ac, dc, dcc so what you did it and that is all that matters, it is compicated
this "hobby" of ours but oh boy the buzz is great.

:doublethumb:thumbs:lol::lol::lol::cool:

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MaxSouthOz
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It's very well done.  I've seen a "professional" one which wasn't as big as that and it didn't work any better. 



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Chubber
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Thanks for all your encouragement, but it's  to be replaced with a Mk II version, using all I've learned on the Mk I.

I shall also give up the idea of it being self-energising, and use 2 DPDT switches to route the juice...'

SWMBO has already given me one of 'those' looks, you know, the 'Who do you think you are, Leonardo Da Vinci?' looks. :cry:



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 Posted: Thu Mar 26th, 2009 11:56 am
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owen69
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yeah fruit die on the vine looks, shudder!!!

:mutley:mutley:cool:

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Gwent Rail
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If you are going to build a mark 2 version, you could always use aluminium angle instead of track, use a bulldog clip to connect and do away with the complex wiring altogether. Our club use a simular method for energising the casette system we use, so let me know if you want some photos when I go tomorrow evening.

Here's one photo which illustrates the method, the second of the two lengths of angle is attached to the "traversing lines" :-

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Chubber
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Thanks for that,  I'll add ally angle to my list of possibles! I know I can get that here, at least.




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 Posted: Mon Apr 6th, 2009 02:51 pm
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Chubber
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Hullo again,

The thinking cap has been on, but little else practical has occurred. At about 4 a.m. on Thursday morning, apparently, I sat up in bed and said, or rather shouted 'Why move the whole [expletive deleted] train!' and promptly lay down and went back to sleep.

It took until yesterday to remember what it was about, i.e. the point of a three track fiddle yard traverser on a BLT layout is to allow a loco to run around the train it tugs in, couple onto a different train, or, the other end of the same one and push off again....yes.....so....why move the whole train to achieve that, why not just move the locomotive......still with me?

Hence, 3 way turnout giving access to three tracks, and a 10-12" long traverser table JUST FOR THE LOCO, a lot easier to keep square and aligned. Yes/No? Or have I finally lost it completely?

see below




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Heljan have released their Traverser - see That shop in Camborne. just around 149 quid!

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henryparrot
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Doug

Why not have a turntable instead of a traverser that way you can change tracks and even turn the loco if you want to,

The set up is the same as your drawing the only differance would be the 2 outside tracks would be curved at the end to meet the turntable.

cheers Brian

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Brian - Why not have a turntable

The best ideas are the simplest, Brian, you're right, but as it will be hidden from view I had hoped to avoid the expense there and have one on the layout elsewhere. Perhaps I could design a wooden one, which I could operate without it being in full view.

Still a 'little job' compared with your retro-fit point motor problem!

Doug



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henryparrot wrote: Doug

Why not have a turntable instead of a traverser that way you can change tracks and even turn the loco if you want to,

The set up is the same as your drawing the only differance would be the 2 outside tracks would be curved at the end to meet the turntable.

cheers Brian
Well, having seen the light at last, I'm going to try the turntable option.  Herewith a go at a fiddle yard TT, MDF disc rebated all round by router to fit a mating hole in the baseboard, an MDF table 3mm smaller in diameter and drilled to accept a concentric plumbing fitting as a bearing, which will, hopefully carry current for one rail.

I'm planning on using 2mm thick nylon 'buttons' under the table for it to slide round on, having first varnished and waxed the lower disc. I plan on gluing a ring of tinplate down to conduct power via a wiper to the other rail.

Off to the shops tomorrow to try and buy some 2-part epoxy resin to glue in the 'bearings'.

For now it will be 'handraulic' but I shall fit a big ply pulley wheel to the copper pipe shaft in case I get adventurous.....or more stupid, whichever comes first. Thinking about spring detents and slipping driving belts again....

Thank God, no traverser dreams......Oh no.....now turntable nightmares..........should it be a sector plate, er, uhm, those aluminium casettes look good, but er, uhm, when I'm pi%%ed I'll drop the lot, oh, why didn't I take up stamp collecting?






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 Posted: Mon Apr 27th, 2009 04:35 pm
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Handraulic sounds good doug the only fuel that requires is a bit of food each day.

The nylon buttons should slide well on a shiny surface. if not a few ball bearings or marbles

cheers Brian

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Wow - the building of a handmade turntable! Looks good already. Superglued to the screen here.

Mike

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I had great fun today, after taking a chum to Bordeaux Airport in some of the heaviest rain I can remember, which turned a 90 minute trip into 2 hours plus of knuckle biting each way, I sweated an 8BA stud to the outer 'bearing' to conduct one rail's current, and using a Bosch router head held in a machine vice on my pillar drill made up a 4" pulley wheel in MDF [remember, if the aluminium kicks in soon I'll be trying auto-drive system...] and drilled and fitted the underside of the table with 4 nylon buttons from some Ikea kitchen units.

I have to make a 3" ring of tinplate to use as a slip-ring to conduct the other rail's current, and tomorrow will try sandwiching some flattened baked bean can between two thin sheets of ply and going at it with a fret-saw blade in my jig-saw, followed by a bit of patient work with a half-round 10" file.........

Catchup with y'all tomorrow, y'hear?  [Sorry, spent 1/2 hour talking to a Texan at the aerodrome.....]







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Marty
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Following this one with keen interest DD.
My Newcastle Emlyn layout will need such a traverser/turntable/sector plate/removable cassette as the Pencader end.
I had decided that cassettes were the way to go... but now I'm not so sure... keep it coming, it's fascinating.
cheers



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This is looking good Doof :thumbs:thumbs

I know what you mean about yesterday's rain - probably one of the worst days this year here !!  It was bad enough just driving the 10 miles from home to our Gite - I wouldn't have wanted to go to Bordeaux Airport (or anywhere on the Autoroute !!)

Re using your vice-held router to run the groove in the pulley - how did you hold the pulley ?  Presumably on a pin of some kind :roll::roll:



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The skill level of some of the modellers on this forum amazes me at times.

Hand building a turntable........................what next :exclam

Great job Doug, I am another that will be watching, although I could never contemplate anything like this.


:doublethumb:doublethumb

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Alan wrote: The skill level of some of the modellers on this forum amazes me at times.

Hand building a turntable........................what next...................................


I'm going to paint a wagon :oops::oops::oops::oops::oops::oops:



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Peter :thumbs

Don't worry we are here to hold your hand ;-)

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:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley

I don't know whether I should be grateful or worried about that Alan !! :roll::roll::roll::roll:



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Pete - Re using your vice-held router to run the groove in the pulley - how did you hold the pulley ? Presumably on a pin of some kind

Hi, Pete, avery tight fit and smear of Bostick, then to get it free, warm the copper pipe with the blowlamp and the glue gives up enough to pull it off. Otherwise I'll drill though the end of the inside of the pipe and insert a self tapper.

Doug



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Petermac
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Thanks Doof - routers take no prisoners !!!



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Wow what a scracth build your doing, looking with interest with this one mate, looking great :thumbs

Phill



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Alan
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Petermac wrote: :mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley

I don't know whether I should be grateful or worried about that Alan !! :roll::roll::roll::roll:

Worried , I have a long arm :hmm but I don't think it will reach you in France :mutley:mutley:mutley

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:wowA handbuilt turntable, BRILL! I am watching this one with facination. Now I'm retired there's less dosh but more time and no rush to squeeze things in between work and essential jobs, making is more of a possibilty, depending on skills of course ..... so this is a fascinating answer to costs . Thanks for sharing the process. Good on you.

Cheers,

John



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Hi, Gang!

As usual, one step forward, one step back....you know if it were to rain Oxtail soup, my bowl would be upside down......

The nylon buttons [sliding on, for the use of, four in number (for those of you who have done national Service etc...)] did not work, I'd have needed the motor from a Dyson to turn the table should I go down the electro-draulic route instead of hand-draulic,

so,

back to the drawing board.

All turn tables run on wheels. Where to find wheels?.

Drawer stops, yes, sliced up drawer stops from M.F.I. furniture, see piccy 1, sawn [very carefully] with a Yappanese pull saw, the silce pressed into a counter-bored hole in a piece of flat tree and then pared flat with a paring chisel, in this case my Dad's old pear-wood handled 5/8" paring chisel . See piccy 2.





Then an axle is needed, the 'Law of Sods' says nothing fits, so file some down in the drill chuck, a.k.a. 'The Bodger's Lathe'. See piccy 3.



Now, the axle needs to align with the natural radius of the table, so draw a diameter line, clamp the table to a square piece of tree, clamp that to the drill press and using a length of steel rod, align the table lines with the chuck. See piccy 4.



Substitute a drill for the rod, swing in the table to the center of the table thickness, and remembering that M.D.F. will 'gas' when end-drilled and tends to split if no escape is provided for the gas [see little holes....] drill slowly into the ends of the table where suitable cut-outs provide a place for each 'wheel' to hide. See piccy 5 and six.





Now it seems to turn quite smoothly....I wonder what the next problem will be??

Poop-poop!




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Petermac
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Wow Doof - talk about learning something !!!

There's so many "hints and tips" there to keep most of us occupied for a month.  Amazing what you can "cobble" together to make an engineering workshop.

Also, I had absolutely no idea about this "gassing" with MDF - that may explain quite a lot of my previous failures and subsequent dislike of the material !!  Presumably it's the resins that cause it ?

The end has certainly justified the means - it looks great.  Just like a "grown-up" would have built. :thumbs:thumbs:thumbs



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Chubber
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Peter - Just like a "grown-up" would have built.

Cheeky Bu%%er.......don't you know I'm nearly nine and three-quarters now!!!!  :twisted:



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Entertaining, informative and innovative. Oh - plus it works. Can't ask for more than that!

Mike

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Gassing!  You learn something every day here . . .



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Ingenuity, there's no end to it and cheap, cheap, cheap, right up my street.



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very nifty Doof,just one thing  why did you wait till i bought one at great expense
then show me the error of my ways???

:mutley:mutley:cool:

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Thanks for your kind remrks, every one,here's the pulley/hand turning wheel which will be under the baseboard, within reach of the operating position.

It will be fixed in position on the shaft by a self tapping screw let into the side of the 'boss' which has been araldited on. The 1/4" dowel on the boss allows the screw to get a grip in the MDF boss without splitting the weaker MDF.

A flexible wire has been sweated inside the the tube which will carry current to one rail, done before assembly to avoid heating copper embedded in MDF.

The other rail will be fed by a wiper contact on a ring of tinplate under the table.

The jury is out on this at the moment as to the best way to do this, attempt number three isn't too bad, but I want better.

Hope this is making sense!!!






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As someone with an engineering background, I'm really loving this one!



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Well, three coats of grey acrylic car primer later, and some chopped up flexi-track and it's looking a bit less 'Blue Peter-ish'.

When I finally glue the track down, I'll cut out the complete sleepers once the other chairs are dry, and it'll look like a line of chairs alone.

[That's the plan...I know...Mice and men....]





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owen69
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at least it`s starting look like a turntable now.

:thumbs:thumbs:lol::lol::cool:

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Now that really is looking like the dog's whatsits !! :thumbs:thumbs:thumbs:thumbs

What are you going to glue the track down with DD ?  I need to do something similar on my estuary bridge and I'm not sure what's the best for that kind of plastic to timber.  A contact adhesive (Evo-bond or Thixofix, my favourite) wouldn't allow for any re-positioning of the track.



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Nice work doof, very professional looking now.



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Nice job DD, i may not of wrote on this thread as yet but i am watching with a keen eye and very much interest.

Phill



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Peter - What are you going to glue the track down with DD ?

I'm not certain yet, but I may use Copydex, it's secure but not 'terminal', if you know what I mean, and give a few minutes working. I intend aligning and sticking one end with the 'feed' line, then turning 180* before sticking down the other end, so that I can reduce eccentricity as much as possible [Thought.......reduce eccentricity...what, on this forum????:lol:]



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dooferdog wrote: ......... so that I can reduce eccentricity as much as possible [Thought.......reduce eccentricity...what, on this forum????:lol:]

Wonderful!!!:mutley:mutley:mutley

Ken.



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hehe

Looks great Doofer.
I glued my track to my bridge with Araldite before removing the sleepers. What a job THAT was.

Mike

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Chubber
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Well, I've been rained off the wall job, so had an hour or two in the workshop and carried on with the turntable.

I'll energise one of the rails by the central copper pipe, [see above] and for the other I have made a little wiper with a brass nail and a spring from beers can tin, to run on a tin plate circle.

I need not have cut away the sleepers, but if I were to do a semi-scale one for a visible part of a layout, it was good practice. 

Having fiddled about getting the central rail to line up with scraps of track in one sense and then 180* about, I ran a little superglue under the two end chairs at each end, which had already been cut from their sleeper, and let them dry. Then, using a little slip of beer-can tin [it's only about 5 thou thick] with superglue on it, I put glue on the underside of the separated chairs, and when they were dry, cut through the whole sleepers with a scalpel before repeating the gluing process with them.

The circular turntable part is fitted into a square of 1/2" MDF with 3 x 4mm studs at 120* centers tapped into the square MDF so that it can be 'levelled' withing the square.








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That's a little gem Doof :thumbs:thumbs

Neat and tidy, it looks the part and is solid as a rock to say nothing of the brilliant "how I did it" write-up and photos explaining every step.  Great stuff. ;-);-)

Now, it's stopped raining here so it must have with you - back to the wall !!  (did you have the "hot one" on Saturday ?  Nearly 35 here - hope you weren't trying to build in that - phew !!)



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Very nicely done Doug your electrical contacts should work fine

How are you reversing the polarity?

cheers brian

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Chubber
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Hi, Peter!

Yup, that was the temp here as well, 13m of 32m finished ready for back filling and rendering..........every thing's been going wrong, mixer drive belt snapped, puncture in the trailer [for the sand collection] and then trailer electrics, then the brushes in my disc cutter.....AAAaaagh!

Still, SWMBO's birthday tomorrow, spcial dinner, drive out and a bottle of bubbly and NO cement!:lol::lol:




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 Posted: Mon Jun 15th, 2009 05:47 pm
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Chubber
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henryparrot wrote: Very nicely done Doug your electrical contacts should work fine

How are you reversing the polarity?

cheers brian
Hi, Brian, duh, not sure! I'll have to think that out when I've not had any RLW [red laughing water]!

I'll probably make the fiddle yard end a separate circuit altogether.

D








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 Posted: Mon Jun 15th, 2009 05:58 pm
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Myansome
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:wow:thumbs I've watched this all with facination. Cool stuff ........ I am filled with admiration!



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 Posted: Wed Jul 1st, 2009 05:35 pm
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Chubber
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Well, an afternoon off yesterday, thought I'd do a bit of turntable, but first......max brownie points, this is a piccy of SWMBO's special birthday meal, salmon with asparagus and Hollandaise sauce wrapped in puff pastry and a Doofer style prawn cocktail.



The brownie points lasted 48 hours until I strimmed wet grass next to clean washing on the line:shock::shock::shock::shock::shock:

Right, back to the TT.

This is the first go at wiring up and trying a loco on the table rail, all worked!

There is no need to do the reverse thing for the 'lectrics, 'forward' when you drive on is forwards off. What happens later is any one's guess.......

First, to make sure the turning table rails were exactly the same length, I put a disc in my mini-drill and, holding the disc and drill firmly in the right place, gently turned the table round until all the four rails were ground to the same length.

I soldered down the first entry/exit rails to brass screws, fixed the revolving table to them with a piece of grooved wood, drilled holes to accept more brass screws brass screws and fixed the opposite rails similarly. I chose 60mm lengths and cut away all but 6 sleepers, and removed the webs and joiners between them to that they could be slid up and down whilst I soldered the rail to brass screws set at the right height. That prevented the sleepers being too close to the hot bit, and kept the gauge well without melting them.

For the first 'extra' entry/exit and in order to make good sense rail geometry-wise, I stuck two bits of rail onto a turnout with rail joiners and laid it on top of the table rail. I carefully marked where the extensions lay across the outer fixed part of the table.

That gave me the 12* angle for the next entry/exit track, which hopefully will align nicely with a three rail feed constructed with the 12* Peco pointwork.










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 Posted: Wed Jul 1st, 2009 05:57 pm
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Petermac
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When you come down to help with my building project Doug - you're doing the cooking - I'll get the asparagus !!!!!

After all that blockwork, I'm surprised your hands are steady enough to make such a good job of the turntable.  How did you fix the track stubs down - screw heads then solder or pins & solder ?  It looks very neat. :thumbs



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Nicely done Doug its going to be a lovely bespoke turntable

cheers Brian

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Chubber
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I soldered down the first entry/exit rails to brass screws, fixed the revolving table to them with a piece of grooved wood, drilled holes to accept more brass screws brass screws and fixed the opposite rails similarly.

That's how, Peter., right first time!

After that meal we are on 'bread and scratchit', hasn't food got expensive here lately?

No, I'd never lifted a brick until I came here, the £7,000 estimate I got for the job convinced me I should learn, quickly!!!



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 Posted: Wed Jul 1st, 2009 06:29 pm
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Petermac
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Yes - sorry Doug - I read it again and saw that sentence (who's a dumbo then !!!)  :oops::oops::oops::oops:  Obviously thrown by the food - made my eyes water so much I couldn't read. :cheers:cheers

You're right about both food and building materials here Doug.  Houses may be much cheaper here than in UK but if you want to do any work on them it's frightening.  I often wonder how the "ordinary" French manage -  maybe a case of 2 prices. :roll::roll:  Certainly half the stuff I see them having done would be way beyond my pockets.



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Alan
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Doof

Have you stopped work on the layout ?

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 Posted: Thu Jan 14th, 2010 02:23 pm
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Chubber
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Hi, A&P,

I haven't stopped work per se, but Tim's Axe has been at work here, too!

See here...  http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=5919&forum_id=54


This has meant dismounting and de-wiring [such as it was] the four 4ft boards from their trestles in the cellar, coming to the conclusion that I would have to shelve plans for a turntable fiddle yard, sell a twin bed bedroom suite, replace it with an Ikea folding double and install a fitted wardrobe with floor to ceiling double sliding doors in the room, otherwise I've been loafing in between doing little projects like van kits etc.

Plucking up courage now to take a saw to some 1/2" ply and some 22mm oak boards to assemble the 'furniture' to support the layout, but currently stymied sourcing 3 mini-bookshelves on castors at a reasonable price of the correct hieght to go underneath the planned layout baseboard.

Oh, does anyone want a multi-lane manual fiddle yard turn table in a fetching shade of grey???  :lol:  see

http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=5061&forum_id=14


Onwards and, er, onwards....


Doug



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 Posted: Thu Jan 14th, 2010 02:30 pm
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owen69
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3 mini-bookshelves on castors.

funny how it always the" little things "that hold you up, strange...

:mutley:mutley:cool:

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Glad to hear that you haven't been touching Peter's wine :roll:

Bookshelfs for under the layout, can't you build them ?

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Chubber
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They HAVE to match the others.............SHE said so. To match the laminate flooring, oh, and the wardrobe doors.

[Insert smiley for haggard, sobbing Doofer]



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Chubber
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Well, with the decision to move upstairs made, losing 3ft-6" of length and 6" in width things had to change.  After several ideas I went for the simplest, a straight 13ft x 2ft board mounted on the wall to avoid legs and things that would have made housework difficult, as the room still has to function as a guest room. The twin bedded cottage suite was sold, a folding bed settee bought to replace it and
I installed the fitted wardrobe etc demanded by Management.

For more details of the wall hung board frame see http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=6213&forum_id=5






Then I had to re-design the layout plan, and decided that virtually all of my pre-built models would no longer fir, so I'll have a lot to bring to the September show bring and buy sale, including the Ringwell clock factory....:sad:, and a fiddle yard turntable....:sad::sad: as I discovered I can get more 'fiddle' with the double sector plate below.

For more details see http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=6273&forum_id=6&highlight=sector+plate






I have finally decided on the following track-plan, the double sector plate being to the right of the tunnel façade.  The top picture is a little strange because it is a 'stitched' picture.









That's where I'll leave it today, the thumb is throbbing! [See Modelling injuries thread....]



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 Posted: Mon May 3rd, 2010 10:48 pm
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Marty
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Nice track plan, plenty of options for operations and scenery.

Looking forward to progress once the injuries heal.



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MikeC
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Doug how could you part with the clock factory? Surely you could squeeze it in.

Mike

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 Posted: Tue May 4th, 2010 04:50 pm
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Chubber
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MikeC wrote: Doug how could you part with the clock factory? Surely you could squeeze it in.

Mike


It's only a model, I'll have another look, but it occurs to me I could tidy it up and put it on the Show stall with some envelopes and auction it for sealed bids for the H4H and RNLI, couldn't I?

Doug



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 Posted: Mon Jul 19th, 2010 06:41 am
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Chubber
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Well, I've been busy elsewhere just lately, at last the 120ft of wall is finished, and rendered.............wiv' tiddly bits of the local field-stone inserted to get away from the 'factory wall' effect.






and some work has gone on at Bear's End. The double sector plate is in position and had been trialled, the layout finalised and wired, a temporary stud and probe board has been attached and a deal of 'testing' taken place.

From the window end




From the door end



What's underneath.......:oops:




'Electric Central'





Temporary stud and probe board, with example of home made plug/connector doodah




Typical motor wiring installation



Seep motor. Note that the 3mm screws in the 3.5mm holes are NOT tightened down completely.

After a great deal of frustration with the switching for the double slip ....[you did warn me, Jeff....] I think I have hit on an unlikely work round for the D/slip as follows.


The average Peco turnout moves sufficiently far to allow a Seep motor to switch successfully, i.e. there is enough travel for the sprung wiper to travel between the two points indicated by the arrows below.

The double slip permits barely half the distance of travel and thus the wiper on the switch arm only just makes contact with the appropriate contact. By allowing the motor to move beneath the board by an extra fraction of a millimetre, better contact is assured, and 100/100 good contacts were achieved.

If you are having contact problems with Seeps, I'd suggest backing off the mounting screws a little.

N.B. This only improves matters if you are operating them electrically, should you have to move them 'handraulically' from above then it won't help.




Well, I hope that has been of some interest, now, I'm off to hide as SWMBO has discovered the blackberry stains that I've walked into the kitchen on my espadrilles.......:shock::shock:

Doug


PS I forgot to say........Hot melt glue sure does hurt when you get it on your fingers...AAaagh! That Fidge is to blame, he recommended it........





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 Posted: Tue Oct 26th, 2010 12:34 pm
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Chubber
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Today is not my day........Having decided to start again on Bear's End I chose to begin putting the tunnel mouth and surrounding 'hill' in place and starting on the mill and stream part first, the end nearest the window. When I uncovered the layout, I saw a gap under some rail and on investigating found the left hand board had warped enormously.......so before I start doing sticky stuff, I'm going to have to de-wire and lift a turnout, cut the board back to the curved bit and relay it with a new bit....AAaagh!




Sobbing Doofer



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 Posted: Tue Oct 26th, 2010 12:42 pm
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ElDavo
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Holy mackerel Doug, that is some warp! Any idea what's caused it?

Cheers
Dave

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 Posted: Tue Oct 26th, 2010 12:50 pm
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phill
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Blimey thats some damage Doug. Hope you know what caused it and you can stop it happening again. On the bright side, if there is one :roll:, at least its just the wiring you have to un do, imagine if it was full of scenery :thud.

Phill



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 Posted: Tue Oct 26th, 2010 01:11 pm
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Chubber
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I have no idea what what's caused it, as I undid the screw it popped up like a spring. As you say, good job I hadn't started ballasting. It was the down-curve of the adjacent unscrewed portion that drew my attention to it.

Dog



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"Beer is proof that God loves us and wants us to be happy" - Benjamin Franklin





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 Posted: Tue Oct 26th, 2010 10:31 pm
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Marty
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Hooley Dooley, something to be said for letting this settle for while before getting into the ballasting and scenics.
I'd take the bit of wood back to the supplier "this bit is na' bludy good and I want a refund"



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Christrerise
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Just twat it with the hammer and put a shed load of screws in and it will be fine!

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Chubber
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Well, I 'twatted' it with a wet towel and boiling water and stuck it down with some of Peters spare screws that fell out of his pocket when he last visited......:mutley


I will just pray I don't have to take it up again, one week on and the bend is very much reduced when unscrewed.

I have decided on my mill building which will span the cut-out in the board [roughly where the red container is in the pictures above. herewith a Google Sketch-up idea of the building, based roughly on the Needle Mill I posted in the prototype picture section.















Cor! Sketch-up, what a programme!  If you think Xtrkcad is a swine to get a handle on, then Sketch-up will have you climbing the walls in 20 minutes max. The trouble is, is that it's addictive............AAagh!


Numbed Brain Cell Doofer




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Chubber
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Having decided to model a building b uilt on the foundations of an earlier mill, I have started on the lower level. A piece of an empty plastic salt container suitably cut gives the curved back wall of the wheel space, the rectangular gap above will hold the water-chute, which ostensibly comes through the building from the other side.









Doug





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Christrerise wrote: Just twat it with the hammer
I'd rather like to see this demonstrated - it's a new one on me.:shock:

Les



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Christrerise
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From the OED: -

To Twat (vb).  To strike something with a very large hammer, very very hard.  Usually accompanied by offensive language.

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 Posted: Thu Nov 11th, 2010 10:32 am
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Les
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Thank you for the elucidation Chris.

Thread back to you Doug - carry on twatting.;-)

Les



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 Posted: Sun Nov 14th, 2010 10:28 am
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Chubber
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Very good, Number One!

The wheel chamber in course of construction




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dooferdog wrote: Very good, Number One!



as spoken by Jean-Luc Picard ?

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I assumed DD had been in the Royal Navy......in the Army it was "Carry on Sergeant"...........there could be a movie title somewhere



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Chubber
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The following story was told to me by an 'Old Soldier'-

On the long push up Italy during WW2 the hapless and ineffective 2 I/C of an ROAC section was at the head of a long column of mixed vehicles with his Sergeant Major when they came across a small river.

He waded thigh-deep into the dirty swirling water and poked at the riverbed with his blackthorn.

'Sgt Major!'

'Sah!' snapped the SM, from the comparative comfort of the bank.....

'Sgt Major, would you say this river had a muddy bottom?'

'Certainly Sir................
`
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'.......THIS RIVER HAS A MUDDY BOTTOM - SAH!!!


Daft Doof



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 Posted: Mon Nov 15th, 2010 11:51 am
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:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley

 

 



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:lol::lol: :thumbs

thanks Doof, needed that.



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Nice one Doof :mutley :mutley

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Piran
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Looking forward to seeing this layout develop it looks good so far doug.Piran

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 Posted: Wed Nov 17th, 2010 04:39 pm
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Chubber
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Starting to build up the landscape around the scenic break/tunnel opening, I hit on the idea of putting a 'lay-by' under the area that is to be the road outside the mill building. The lay-by is long enough to hold a Dean Goods [and tender] and will be anther place to store a loco or indeed a brake van whilst organising another train on the sector plate.










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 Posted: Wed Nov 17th, 2010 04:50 pm
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georgejacksongenius
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Doug,
        I really like that filthy tunnel mouth!You can almost taste the soot.Luvverly paint job.
:pathead

Cheers,John.B.:thumbs

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 Posted: Wed Nov 17th, 2010 05:07 pm
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Chubber
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Thanks, John, it looks better from this side.... and it reminds me to weather the other side of the refuge although only I will see it from the sector plate side.




Doug




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 Posted: Wed Nov 17th, 2010 08:01 pm
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I love the detail Doug..........I am about to install a couple of tunnel mouths and would never have thought of a rfuge or wiring until I saw this...................many thanks 



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The tunnel mouth is amazing!:doublethumb

Thomas



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Doug, great weathering on that tunnel mouth. It looks super!

Wayne



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 Posted: Fri Nov 19th, 2010 10:59 am
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Michael Thornberry
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Hello Doug,
Just imagine how good you're going to be at this "modelling-lark" with an extra 10/15 years practice. :roll::lol: Seriously, mate, this is especially good and imaginative,
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.

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 Posted: Sat Nov 20th, 2010 04:53 am
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Chubber
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Thank you for all your encouragement, chaps, herewith progress to date, to the right, the proposed site of a two-holer lime kiln, whether working or abandoned I don't know yet. The big cardboard right angle is the 'form' for the mill building so that I can construct the building in my little office room yet carry on with the landscaping at this end.




The same but from a different angle, showing the 3/16" gap fpr the insertion of an mdf back scene, [probably by about 2015 at this rate], and the same gap at the front for a dressing board to front the scenery that rises above base board level. The nearest bevelled edge thingy on the deck is the long siding which will end in front of the tunnel surround and the rear one is the main line out of the tunnel [which was re-built in 1909 as a single line after the earthquake that also cut off the other end of Bear's End from the Wheal Gravy Pasty Mines further west..........Prior to that it was called Bear's Middle.....]



and whilst I was fitting the layby under the scenery for the Dean Goods on the right, I couldn't resist putting one in on the left for the Pannier Tank, although it moves the proposed lime kilns forward a little.




I'm getting a bit excited about it now, as I've never built any railway scenery before and it's good to learn new things.

I was surprised this past week to see a lime kiln as the centre of attention on 'The Edwardian Farm' programme, very useful. I expect to see lots of them on layouts now!

Well, back to clearing up bits of Poly-bloody-styrene.....'There's some in the hall-way, and when are you going to empty my Hoover.....You're worse that Bisto for mess, at least his is all at floor level...No! I don't believe it, there's some stuck to the television screen...DOUGLAS!!!!!....:roll::roll:



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 Posted: Sat Nov 20th, 2010 07:55 am
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ddolfelin
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"I'm getting a bit excited about it now, as I've never built any railway scenery before and it's good to learn new things."

Well, I can see some bits of wood for a start.
Do you plan on painting the church?
The trees perhaps could do with some work, perhaps.

(grinning smiley)

The concept is looking very good (as usual).
Recommend hot wire cutter for expanded polystyrene. If you have a step-down transformer, you could easily make your own, Doug.



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 Posted: Sat Nov 20th, 2010 09:36 am
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Chubber
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you could easily make your own, Doug.

Hhhm. What sort of wire does it have to be? I imagine you'd need some special high resistance wire, I'll have a 'Google', later.

Cheers,

Doug



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 Posted: Sat Nov 20th, 2010 10:54 am
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ddolfelin
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It's only the bit that's stretched taught needs to be high resistance (someone will know the ampage etc.).
The replacement wires are quite cheap to buy (I'll go and wash my mouth out).
Have a look on Google images for the designs available.
I use a battery version I've converted to mains through a transformer.



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 Posted: Sat Nov 20th, 2010 11:39 am
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Chubber
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ddolfelin wrote: The replacement wires are quite cheap to buy (I'll go and wash my mouth out).
 


Noted, thanks.

I must have a look at an old electric fire element I have in the cellar......

Deffo 'Hhum'

Doug



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 Posted: Sun Nov 21st, 2010 01:11 pm
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Chubber
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Can you tell what it is yet?  Yup, a double barrelled brick doodoo-house, you win the cigar!




Doug







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 Posted: Sun Nov 21st, 2010 01:22 pm
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owen69
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more to the point ,how did you make the brick inserts  that will be dropped in.
and I don`t smoke...

:mutley:lol::cool:

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 Posted: Sun Nov 21st, 2010 02:41 pm
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Chubber
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Hi, Owen,

I've used two lengths of scrap drain pipe [from the tip] and ten Scalescenes arch window lintels, 5 per tube to cover the top edge, by cutting 1mm fingers of paper to glue on the inside. Then I lined the tubes with a piece of brick paper, lleaving the soldier coure on the top edge. I've reinforced the overhanging paper with 2mm annuli of mount card so that when they sit down into the deck level they will stand up a fraction. I'll run a 1mm wide strip around the raw edges before putting them in place.



Hope that explains it well enough,











Doug



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 Posted: Sun Nov 21st, 2010 03:40 pm
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owen69
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well enough for me, that is how I would do it,:cheers
now about that ceegar....

:thumbs:lol::lol::cool:

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 Posted: Sun Nov 21st, 2010 05:23 pm
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Petermac
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I'd like to know how you managed to cut such perfect circles in that thick card and also, how you bent that "U" shaped piece sitting on top.

Did you sand the edges of the circles after cutting or use a compass cutter ?  They look far better than anything I've ever achieved along those lines.



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Chubber
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Petermac wrote: I'd like to know how you managed to cut such perfect circles in that thick card and also, how you bent that "U" shaped piece sitting on top.

Did you sand the edges of the circles after cutting or use a compass cutter ?  They look far better than anything I've ever achieved along those lines.


Hi again, Peter,

You are right, the compass cutter won't do the thick card, it's only made of plastic but it does give a neat incised line to cut around and around with a pointed scalpel blade held almost vertically [murder on the achy wrists etc] No sandpaper, but a new sharp blade. I use lots of small blades, I must have got through a dozen and a half building the harbour Office.

If you dampen the thick [2mm] card before you bend it up over a pencil before 'wrapping' it around a shaped piece of card it will partly de-laminate and set in an hour bent if smeared with PVA.

HTH,

Doug



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 Posted: Mon Nov 22nd, 2010 03:59 am
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phill
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now thats a nice bit of work Doof. I always said you was clever mate, :thumbs. Now i take it the 4 legged helper gave you a paw to do the job as well.

Are you going to put some sort of smoke devise in there for realism or not?

Phill



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 Posted: Mon Nov 22nd, 2010 04:17 am
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Petermac
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Thanks for the explanations Doug. :thumbs

"A dozen and a half"  scalpel blades :shock::shock::shock:  Is that the snap-off type you seem to favour or the Swann-Morton surgical scalpel blades.  If the latter, then you need to charge more for your buildings........................:lol::lol::lol::lol:

I know sharp tools are important (as well as safer than blunt ones) but I think of the 20p I throw away everytime I change my Swan-Morton No. 11 blade.  Also, I'm not too sure that UK suppliers will ship them overseas.  Maybe there's some restriction on posting knife blades..........:roll::roll:



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 Posted: Mon Nov 22nd, 2010 04:19 am
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Chubber
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I really don't know, Phill, it might be a bit 'twee'. I have not decided if it will be 'abandoned' with lots of greenery, partly filled in, some 'wreckage' at the bottom, or in use, with a partly filled kiln, and one being emptied into barrels, a little barrel roll/barrow track to the edge of the rail track, a tip cart at the top with coal/stone etc. Trouble is I'd have to buy lots of those things...ooh, I feel faint..


Doug



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 Posted: Mon Nov 22nd, 2010 04:24 am
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owen69
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Peter, I re-sharpen my blades on an oil stone,get twice the mileage.then use them for rough cutting
that`s only 5p a blade.

:Happy:lol::cool:

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ddolfelin
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"I must have a look at an old electric fire element I have in the cellar......"

Too thick, I think, Doug.
The one I have uses very fine wire.
Squires sell the spares at £1.30 for 3 ... although I've never needed a replacement.

While I'm off topic:
Your hacksaw blade plastic cutter is in the Squires catalogue at £5.99/£6.99.
Replacement blades are £1.99 for 5 or £3.99 for 5.

MEANWHILE, back on the topic,
Those chimbleys look great.



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Chubber
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Peter*, I'm referring to Swann and Morton type blades, I bought a box of 50 some time ago and they worked out at about 3-4p each. The snap-offs I use for cutting long straight things and construction cuts in card, but for window frames etc it needs new ones, or for fine frames they need rubbing down thinner on worn wet and dry as Owen suggests, but sometimes I can't be bothered!

Doug


* If you have a shop called 'Kalou' in your area, which sells all sorts of household goods, they also sell blades for craft knives in the sewing department.  [It has a kangaroo as the shop motif]

D


While I'm off topic:
Your hacksaw blade plastic cutter is in the Squires catalogue at £5.99/£6.99.
Replacement blades are £1.99 for 5 or £3.99 for 5.

Bloomin'cheek!

Re the wires etc, thanks, DD

D



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I felt sure I'd posted these two next pictures. but  maybe not!

An interesting shape to build, no right angles anywhere.  I will have to wait until I've got some black spray paint for the railings which I've made up from 2mmx0.8mm strip and 0.8mm rod, glued up with MEK. I miss-drillled three or four stanchions but soon got the hang of it.















The railings will fix to the front and sides of the 'thing'.

Doug



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It's a beautiful thang, Doug.  Is it a brick kiln - or a large pizza oven?  :chicken



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Whatever it is, that's very clever work to get the two arches looking the same.



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It looks very nice mate but i do think it is more of a giant ink well :mutley.

Still i am envious of the build, its superb.

Phill



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Lovely work as ever. Possibly a lime kiln? I think I would have been tempted to use brass wire for the handrails as I know I would knock them at some point in the future.

Cheers
Dave

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ddolfelin
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Inkwell!
Thinks 'there may be some commercial mileage in that!'



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Whatever it is, it is built with Doofer's usual precision and excellence.

It reminds me very much of one of Abram Darby's Bedlam furnaces at Ironbridge, not many yards from where I live!

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ElDavo wrote: Lovely work as ever. Possibly a lime kiln? I think I would have been tempted to use brass wire for the handrails as I know I would knock them at some point in the future.

Cheers
Dave



Thanks again for the encouragement, Dave, yes  twin lime kilns, each capacity about 20-30 tons. I shall stick on the guard rails with Bostik Glue-pen. It's good for things like this because  you can make the components 'Post-it note sticky', by applying it to both surfaces and letting it dry. There after you can press it on and knock it off without too much damage being done.


Doug



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Doug,
How did you do the corners? The ones that look like concrete blended into the cut stone.

Wayne



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That looks superb Doug - as ever !!

Is the stonework embossed ?  It certainly looks like it but I remember having difficulty in believing a harbour wall on here some time ago was only Scalescenes paper.



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Doug, How did you do the corners?

Hullo, Wayne, not quite sure what you mean, all the corners, edges etc are butt joints or overlaps of Scalescenes texture papers, the 'deck', which will be highly distressed and chipped away as will the brick rims, is covered with 'TX16 Grey stone Wall', the front and sides are covered with'TX48 Squared Rubble'. The Grey Stone Wall comes with two strips of plain rectangular matching stone blocks, and the Squared Rubble comes with similar regular blocks, and sets of quoins [for the corner blocks] Note that the corner blocks have to be cut out at an angle, not straight and right angled as they are provided so that they run horizontally even though applied to  sloping faces.


Is the stonework embossed ? It certainly looks like it ..
Hi, Peter, no, the surface is not embossed at all, by pasting it on the right way up* the texture paper looks quite realistic. I have yet to cut some out, undercut others and press in a few here and there to give a genuine, if very slight, textured finish.

* There really is an upper and lower alignment to consider with some good texture papers. Careful examination of a such paper will show that there is an 'under-shadow' on some sheets, my default convention is to have shadows from above and slightly to the right. All my model buildings adhere to that rule which I bear in mind when applying shadow lines, e.g. under window sills. The black line I draw under a sill will project marginally beyond the lower left hand side and end fractionally before the lower right hand side.




I hope that makes sense?


Doug



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 Posted: Wed Nov 24th, 2010 11:26 am
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It makes a lot of sense Doug and I've also learnt something new.  I had no idea that texture papers had an up-side and a down-side.  I'll have to take more notice in future. :oops::oops:



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dooferdog wrote:






 

Far be it from me to even consider criticising the master's work, but, how will you hide the white edges to the quions, as can be seen on the leftmost corner on the image above ?

Stu



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As the inane insurance advertisement says 'Oh, yes!' The majority of the left hand side will be buried in the embankment that it all backs into, no weathering etc done yet.

I shall probably, where there are white edges use an appropriate line of watercolour pencil before running a moist brush along the line. I shall also try the technique of sponging on a few areas of acrylic paint, or watercolour in body colour [a paste-like substance] to represent lichen and moss as the main front wall will have an easterly aspect.

The top surface will have very little of the original surface left showing, as carts would have backed up to it to unload limestone and coal down the big 'oles. The lower area will have the dusty finish reminiscent of the clay dries on Les' building.

Doug



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Petermac wrote: It makes a lot of sense Doug and I've also learnt something new.  I had no idea that texture papers had an up-side and a down-side.  I'll have to take more notice in future. :oops::oops:


Me too Peter - I just looked at some & saw the difference especially on stonework.

Just proves a point - never too old to learn new tricks - thanks Doofer:thumbs

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Surely

John wiffen at Scalescenes should have a this way up arrow on the printout as im sure most people who download his papaers dont realise there is a right and wrong way.

Brian

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Just a couple of 'before any paint' pictures to show some pretty severe distressing, e.g.

cut out areas of stone, paper peeled off, scraped out and peeled off bit replaced, brick shaped pieces of card cut right out in square shapes, a top edge stone cut out, paper peeled off and replaced 1mm down, he brick rims battered about generally, but with square cuts in mind. Some of the deep depressions can realistically be expected to harbour vegetation, etc.






a couple of slabs 'lifted', scraped out and replaced crookedly [we've all got these on our terraces, I'm sure!], complete stone out of the coping and the edge of a Stanley knife pressed into the lines between the coping stones to give gaps/joints opened by the weather



some of the latter may look over-done at this stage but will be a little muted with some paint, filler and coal/limestone





Hope this gives some ideas.......

Doug



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What was new... is now old :thud

... and no... I'm not talking about Bisto.



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Doug,
       This is what makes your models so damn special.Most of us would've been happy to leave them "pristine",but you have the confidence and/or courage to attack the bloomin' things with a knife and take the risk of possibly ruining all your good work.
       I think its as much of a skill as the actual modelling....knowing how far you can/should go down that road.
       Clever Old Doofer!!!
:pathead:pathead:pathead

Cheers,John.B.:thumbs

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Amazing Doug - just amazing :shock::shock::thumbs:thumbs:thumbs:thumbs




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Couldnt agree more :thumbs

Its a brilliant model, as one would expect, but what makes it uniques is the subject which I have never seen modelled before 

I really look forward to your updates......so much to learn and lots of humour..........still chuckling about the vacuum cleaner

Regards



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Herewith, finished version. I haven't decided what to do with the ends of the railings so they can stay like that for now.

Weathering with watercolours dropped into wetted surfaces, and black/light grey/brown pastels scraped onto a saucer and brushed on.

Hope you like it,















Doug







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I haven't decided what to do with the ends of the railings, said Doof.

You can send them to me but please leave them connected to the brickwork mate.

Another fantastic bit of work.



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Absolutely wonderful, Doug. Truely amazing how you manage to get such a realistic looking model from card, paper and paint. Can't wait to see it in place.

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ElDavo
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Crackin' work Doug. Very impressive.

Cheers
Dave

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That is just bleedin' great :cry: :Red Card

Not only have I got to pluck up the courage to weather my buildings I've now got to attack them with a scalpel. I might as well not bother building them in the first place.

:thud



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Applause, applause!



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Woweeee Doug. :thumbs

Brilliant - filled with clever details and looks just as it ought to.  I particularly like the kiln tops with the lime residues kicking around.



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Nice



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Great work, Doug, an I love your attention to detail re the light direction and shadows. :thumbs :thumbs :thumbs

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Marvelous, we never going to compete with this sort of work, astounding.

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I can't believe all those railings are still straight, considering how much the stonework has deteriorated over the years....

But as has been said, this is another excellent piece of modelling.:pathead



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Stubby47 wrote: I can't believe all those railings are still straight, considering how much the stonework has deteriorated over the years....

But as has been said, this is another excellent piece of modelling.:pathead


....they are at the moment. When a tip cart bangs into them in 1937 they will be a tidge wonkled...


D



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Ah, them 1937 cart drivers, no consideration for property...



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Doug,
Now just where did you dig up that old looking thing? If I hadn't watched you build it.......

Great job of weathering Doug, and I like the bits of clutter you have placed on and around it. Very convincing!

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Another masterpiece and master-class.Thanks for showing us how you do it Doug.I for one never,ever tire of seeing your work.It is quite literally in a class of its own!!!
:thud
Cheers,John.B.:thumbs

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Well, encouraged by your kind words I've had a play with some scenery stuff.



Ain't it messy! Plenty of yellow cards from the management, but to date she hasn't seen the brown paint on my second best shirt-cuff...Douglas! Don't you play with that messy stuff in that shirt, and where's your apron? Elaine gave you one for Xmas.....'


Dabbling Doofer





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spot on !! now where did the steps come from ?weathered perfectly.

:pathead:lol::cool:

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That really looks good Doug,  congratulations   :pathead

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That building really sits well in its location, Doug.
More amazing skill.
Not sure about the lump of bark but you're probably not finished yet.
Do you think it needs more surrounding veg?

... and great job on the steps - not an easy thing to model.

Off topic: I bought one of those non ridge making Doofer-like cutters and it does what it says on the tin.
Much slower than a Stanley knife but also much neater.



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That looks like you made it for just that spot! :shock: :shock: :shock:

Seriously Doug, you have done a super job on this build.

Wayne



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As always looks great Doug

Are you going to give us a step by step on the stairs?



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It sits beautifully Doug but the weathering, on the kiln, the bridge and the steps, is just out of this world.  Proper artists see things and colours that most mere mortals wouldn't have a clue about let alone managing to get the colours right on the little we do see.  Yours are absolutely spot on.  Not too much and not too little. :pathead



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John Dew wrote:
Are you going to give us a step by step on the stairs?

:mutley

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Doug

Far be it for me to offer some small critique on your superb handiwork but I will.

It might be the angle we are viewing them from but those steps look a little too perfect to my eyes compared to the semi-dereliction of the kilns. Wouldn't they be in a similar condition with a few chipped treads?



:cool wink



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I love it,Doug.The only thing I'd change,is I'd add more patches of green over that big chunk of bark,or whatever it is,next to your steps.I'd leave a few bands of "rock strata" showing through,but as it stands,it looks too brown and wrinkly there!(to me!)Some weeds/shrubs would be nice too.
   And do try not to mess up your shirt this time!!!:roll:

Cheers,John.B.:thumbs

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All helpful suggestions noted, watch this space, although I may be in a state of nervous exhaustion soon, SWMBO has uttered those words, guaranteed to strike fear into any man..."I want to change the sitting room furniture around...":shock::shock:


Worried Doofer



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Oh gawd... quick, run man, run :pedal



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Now is the time then to suggest that a small shunting plank, on top of the bookcases, would make an excellent conversation piece in the sitting room...



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Doug

Your best diplomacy is required there you must convince here its her idea not to do it and she has everything in the perfect place already as she is a top class interior designer.

Trouble is if she does it will be new carpet and then of course that will lead on to the room looks a but tired now so needs totally redecorating:lol::lol:

For the sake of your modelling time this needs your full attention:lol:

brian

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Just tell her you aint doing it and that its fine as it is. After all your the boss mate so stand your ground, :thumbs.

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Shelagh knows where you live Phill:mutley:mutley

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phill wrote:
Just tell her you aint doing it and that its fine as it is. After all your the boss mate so stand your ground, :thumbs.

Phill


Ah yes! but does he have her permission to say he's the boss

I'll get my coat:lol:



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I'd just hide in one of those kilns until the dust settles Doug...............:roll:



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John Dew wrote: As always looks great Doug

Are you going to give us a step by step on the stairs?


Best pun of the week so far...I spotted it, at least

D



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Hello Doug,
Have you left home yet? :shock: What is the upper-age limit for joining the French Foreign Legion(isn't 75 too old, mate)  :lol:Probably your best bet would be to throw-in the towel, now, otherwise you may need one to stem the flow of blood,
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.

PS Eeny Meeny Miny Six - Our Doug is in a real-bad fix

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:shock::shock::shock::shock:


It hasn't been a very easy day, I'm sure you'll understand! I have at least managed to partly get my way and keep my seat next the bookcase and stereo.

I have a much better view of the road from this corner of the vegetable patch.....
    Doug



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 Posted: Wed Dec 1st, 2010 11:03 am
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John Dew
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dooferdog wrote: John Dew wrote: As always looks great Doug

Are you going to give us a step by step on the stairs?


Best pun of the week so far...I spotted it, at least

D


Glad you liked it.......sometimes I fear I am too subtle

It was a semi serious enqury as well.....I am intrigued to know how you built the stairs.....perhaps when you have emerged from hiding?



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 Posted: Wed Dec 1st, 2010 11:06 am
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Michael Thornberry
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Hello Doug,
Oh no, mate, banished from your nice warm hearth to do sentry-duty on that new garden-wall of yours, Hadrian's something, isn't it. Never mind, Doug, at least you can visit on your way NORTH, to Corbridge, on the A68, but, don't forget to bring your snow=boots and  Modelling Tools with you. There's always a welcome in the Dales for a man of your calibre,
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.

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John Dew wrote: dooferdog wrote: John Dew wrote: As always looks great Doug

Are you going to give us a step by step on the stairs?


Best pun of the week so far...I spotted it, at least

D


Glad you liked it.......sometimes I fear I am too subtle

It was a semi serious enqury as well.....I am intrigued to know how you built the stairs.....perhaps when you have emerged from hiding?


John, I have done a little how-to in the 'Hints Tips and smaller projects' section, just in case I forget myself...

[I'm back indoors, the snow got too much for me, but I did pull up some parsnips and carrots before it got too bad, Beef stew with dumplings tomorrow!]



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 Posted: Wed Dec 1st, 2010 08:29 pm
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Marty
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dooferdog wrote: [I'm back indoors, the snow got too much for me, but I did pull up some parsnips and carrots before it got too bad, Beef stew with dumplings tomorrow!]

Really?!... and with the airports and roads all snowed in, not a dicky birds chance of me getting there! Sigh.  Would have brought a bottle of Margaret River Red too. :thumbs



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Marty wrote: ......................................................................................................................................................................  Would have brought a bottle of Margaret River Red too. :thumbs

And French Customs would have nicked that the minute you stepped into the country Marty - on the gorunds of National Security. :cheers



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 Posted: Thu Dec 2nd, 2010 11:21 pm
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Marty
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Hmmm, they'd have to fight me for it. :twisted:



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 Posted: Sun Dec 12th, 2010 01:01 pm
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Chubber
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Well, having taken the advice above, I have opened up the area next to thekiln, and had a bit of a fiddle about, I think this is better. I am currently doing some small ruined walls, very much harder than it seems, more difficult than doing a complete building, I'm on the third try now, pictures when they are done.




Doug


PS  I no longer have a second-best shirt.............just one good one [which I shall have to wear when I visit Peter next week] and several others, all anointed with paint or glue in various places. It seems I got 'Deep Truffle' Dulux wall paint on my beard, and thence onto the front of once second-best shirt.

PPS  Thinking I could make light of it, I added the words 'Oh sorry! I've been overcome with emulsion...' but it didn't seem to help very much :oops::sad:



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 Posted: Sun Dec 12th, 2010 01:23 pm
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Petermac
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:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley:mutley

Truffles - deep or otherwise - are worth a fortune Doug so keep Bisto away from the beard .............:roll::roll:

The change to the kilns is astounding.  Much, much better now. :thumbs:thumbs:thumbs



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 Posted: Sun Dec 12th, 2010 03:04 pm
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Michael Thornberry
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Hello Doug,
If making a "dog's dinner", of your beard and shirt, turns you and Bisto   :mutley"on", who are we to formally criticise your modelling mishaps, mate  :It's a no no. Oh, by the way, great kiln and I agree with Peter it looks "betterer"(it's better than better) than the original. Those steps look superb,
Kind Regards,
Michael Thornberry.

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 Posted: Sun Dec 12th, 2010 04:56 pm
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georgejacksongenius
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Yes,I think it looks more betterer than it did too!(but not quite as betterer than your bestest betterer!):roll::lol::lol::lol:........but still VERY good?
:pathead

Cheers,John.B.:thumbs

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 Posted: Mon Dec 13th, 2010 01:19 am
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