Video Archive         Recent Topics      
YMR logo

You are here:  Your Model Railway Club > Getting You Started. > Layout Design, Trackwork & Operation. > Iron Ore Layout To bottom of page
                 

 Moderated by: Spurno
Start New Topic Reply Printer Friendly

Iron Ore Layout - Layout Design, Trackwork & Operation. - Getting You Started. - Your Model Railway Club
AuthorPost
 Posted: Sat Nov 5th, 2016 10:46 pm
PMQuoteReply
link to this 1st post
regme
Full Member
 

Joined: Thu Nov 3rd, 2016
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 15
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Hi

After running a semi permanent layout, I have the space to create something more permanent.  My layout in HO and in DC, since my electrical knowlegde is enough to be dangerous.

In my orginal layout I used two very old controllers but now I want to improve on what I have.  I have a regulated power supply that I want to use (DSE D3800) to run three sections of the track, outer loop, inner loop and sidings.  I was going to use one power supply to run all three, and use an LM2596 DC-DC Step down, potentiometers to control the voltage with a voltmeter and DPDT switch to change the direction, the point motors I was going to use 751D point controller.  I have kids who would like to use it too, hence the voltmeter was going to indicate the speed.

The D3800 specs are 3-15v 25Amp, there are also two outputs for a low current (3amp I think).  I guess this might be an over kill, I was going to use the low out terminals to run the whole thing

I have been looking for control panel ideas, I would like to incorporate it as part of the layout rather than off to the side but I have been coming up short.  I have two location for the control panels I just need a place to start.

Cheers

 


Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Sun Nov 6th, 2016 02:45 pm
PMQuoteReply
link to this 2nd post
Spurno
Owner/Webmaster.


Joined: Tue Aug 14th, 2012
Location: Torquay, United Kingdom
Posts: 3731
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Hi Reg and welcome to the club.Looks an interesting layout so keep us updated with it's progress.



____________________
Regards

Alan


Born beside the mighty GWR.
Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Sun Nov 6th, 2016 04:04 pm
PMQuoteReply
link to this 3rd post
BCDR
Moderator


Joined: Sat Oct 19th, 2013
Location: Reston, Virginia USA
Posts: 1903
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Hi Reg,

Welcome. DC control is mostly a black box to me, I can only recommend the book by Roger Amos, which describes overlapping block control (among other things). From the system description you seem to be using voltage rather than pulse width control (as found in modern DC control units). Did I get that right? If so you might get better slow speed running with a pulse width controller running at constant voltage. Which I think works better with older, inefficient motors that need a kick to get them going.

Nigel



____________________
©Nigel C. Phillips
Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Mon Nov 7th, 2016 02:10 pm
PMQuoteReply
link to this 4th post
regme
Full Member
 

Joined: Thu Nov 3rd, 2016
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 15
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Hi

Thanks for the welcome. 

As for the PWM, seems like that needs to be in place between the power supply and the track, I'll have to add that onto the list of things thath require more understanding.

I have nailed down my layout, now I have need for clarification regarding the control of my layout. Initially I thought of using one power supply and creating three simple controllers using a potentiometers and a step down component to run the inner, outer loops and sidings. Upon further searching I found I can create blocks where I can wire it up to allow the use of just two controllers and the use of DPDT switches to swap between the controllers.

So if I have this right, in theory I can use one controller for the outer loop swap over to the inner loop just by switching that particular block to that controller, rather than swaping between controllers.

However, how would I isolate parts of the layout using that method.

Or would it be better to to run the outer and sidings with two controllers and set the inner loop to a constant speed and have a train just run around it, since the outer loop and sidings would require more driver input for operations

Just to add I was going to run the inner and outer loops in opposite directions.

Cheers

Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Mon Nov 7th, 2016 10:32 pm
PMQuoteReply
link to this 5th post
Sol
A modelling Moderator.


Joined: Mon Nov 28th, 2011
Location: Evanston Gardens, South Aust, Australia
Posts: 3225
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Re the electrics - can I suggest you start on this http://brian-lambert.co.uk/Electrical.html
then go to our Index
http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=803&forum_id=46



____________________
Ron
NCE DCC ; 00 scale UK outline.
Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Tue Nov 8th, 2016 05:14 am
PMQuoteReply
link to this 6th post
regme
Full Member
 

Joined: Thu Nov 3rd, 2016
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 15
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Hi

Thanks for the links, I have been to the Brian Lambert Site before and managed to build a CDU without electrocuting myself :lol:.

I was just trying to gauge if my thinking was right, before I go off half cocked.  I have been told just go DCC, but that's a money issue.

I have gone through the links and there are few that need upgrading

E.
Electric - Pencil - Make Your Own - Barchester Project.                                  Site Frozen Hopefully this will get sorted in time.
Electrical - Bits - Brian Lambert - Article - Link.                                                Not Found   FIXED
Electrics & Electronics - Link.                                                                           Link requires updating
Electronics - Automatic Shuttle Unit - Online Supplier - Link.                           Went to a Telstra survey DELETED
Electronics - Basic - Resistors - Capacitors - Diodes - Soldering And More.    Link requires updating
Electronics - Circuit Symbols - What They Mean                                              Link requires updating
Electronics - Practical - Easy To Understand - Link.                                         Not Found DELETED


A lot of information to go through, great site, might have go and get an Electrical Engineering degree :lol:

Cheers

Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Tue Nov 8th, 2016 06:02 am
PMQuoteReply
link to this 7th post
Sol
A modelling Moderator.


Joined: Mon Nov 28th, 2011
Location: Evanston Gardens, South Aust, Australia
Posts: 3225
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Reg, thanks for that - some of those kinks have been sorted.



____________________
Ron
NCE DCC ; 00 scale UK outline.
Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Tue Nov 8th, 2016 09:14 am
PMQuoteReply
link to this 8th post
Spurno
Owner/Webmaster.


Joined: Tue Aug 14th, 2012
Location: Torquay, United Kingdom
Posts: 3731
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Hi Reg,some of the links will be hit and miss i'm afraid as there are issues regarding site ownership of the Barchester index.At the moment can i suggest that you Google any links that don't work.



____________________
Regards

Alan


Born beside the mighty GWR.
Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Mon Nov 14th, 2016 10:16 pm
PMQuoteReply
link to this 9th post
regme
Full Member
 

Joined: Thu Nov 3rd, 2016
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 15
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Well here is the layout on the baseboard, now to start wiring it up


Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Tue Nov 15th, 2016 01:26 am
PMQuoteReply
link to this 10th post
BCDR
Moderator


Joined: Sat Oct 19th, 2013
Location: Reston, Virginia USA
Posts: 1903
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Hi Reg,

Well no wonder you're having problems, the underneath is full of stuff! And a cold, hard floor to boot. Plus that curvy wall can't help (hopefully it's a fish-eye lens, although given where I come from with its outside staircases maybe not). I thought for a minute you were trying out the track plan on a billiard table.

Re the electrickery, it sounds as if you need what's called a "progressive cab control". This allows you to keep the same throttle via automatic switching of blocks as the train moves along (via block occupancy detection - look Ma, no hands). The book "Complete book of model railway electronics, 2nd Edition" by Roger Amos covers this in depth (and describes a 3 throttle system). Useful stuff to understand, especially for those of us using DCC. The point that caught my attention was that "it's much cheaper than command control". Well, it was back in 1998. Not so sure now. A basic system such as the NCE (2 amp) and 2 additional throttles is not that expensive, it all depends on how many locomotives you are planning on running and whether you want sound. Three sound decoders would be more expensive than the command system and throttles. 

Nigel



____________________
©Nigel C. Phillips
Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Tue Nov 15th, 2016 04:44 am
PMQuoteReply
link to this 11th post
regme
Full Member
 

Joined: Thu Nov 3rd, 2016
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 15
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Well that's after I moved everything out.  Yes fish-eye lens, but a curve house that would be interesting.

Well I just got hold of the "Complete book of model railway electronics, 1st Edition" I hope the 2nd is not too much different.  I looked into the Progress Cab Control, but if you run DCC it's pretty much out the window, that's my understanding.

It use to be a scalextric track, hence the green.

Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Thu Nov 17th, 2016 05:01 am
PMQuoteReply
link to this 12th post
regme
Full Member
 

Joined: Thu Nov 3rd, 2016
Location: Perth, Australia
Posts: 15
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

Hi

I have started to think about the control panel before I start to wire things up.  It will be A4 in size.  I'm going to keep the point control separate to the DCC part.  Ant comments are most welcomed

Cheers


Back To Top PMQuoteReply

 Posted: Wed Nov 23rd, 2016 10:48 pm
PMQuoteReply
link to this 13th post
BCDR
Moderator


Joined: Sat Oct 19th, 2013
Location: Reston, Virginia USA
Posts: 1903
Status: 
Offline

My photos:
view photos in Gallery
view photos as slides

regme wrote: Well that's after I moved everything out.  Yes fish-eye lens, but a curve house that would be interesting.

Well I just got hold of the "Complete book of model railway electronics, 1st Edition" I hope the 2nd is not too much different.  I looked into the Progress Cab Control, but if you run DCC it's pretty much out the window, that's my understanding.

It use to be a scalextric track, hence the green.
Hi Reg,

Even the 2nd edition was just at the point when command control was starting to be used. Roger Amos was DC. If you run DCC you don't need progressive cabs that keep a dead zone in front of and behind the locomotive, thus allowing more than one train to be run on the same live track. If you want to consist locomotives you need DCC. Whether you have blocks is another subject. Large layouts should, with smaller ones it is probably unnecessary unless you have complicated track work and want to avoid a short shutting down the whole layout (even a momentary one will cut sound out unless everything has capacitor or LiPo battery back-up).

Nigel



____________________
©Nigel C. Phillips
Back To Top PMQuoteReply

This is topic ID = 14690     Current time is 03:05 pm  
You are here:  Your Model Railway Club > Getting You Started. > Layout Design, Trackwork & Operation. > Iron Ore Layout
You can type a quick reply to this topic here. Click in the box below to begin.

Or to reply to an individual post, or to include images, attachments and formatted text,
click the Quote or Reply buttons on each post above.

To start a new topic in this forum, click the Start New Topic button below.
To start a new topic in a different forum, click the Forum Jump drop-down list below.
Start New Topic


Back to top of page

           
15 Most Recent Topics

Problems with this web site? Please contact the Webmaster.

All material submitted to this web site is the responsibility of the respective contributor. By submitting material to this web site you acknowledge that you accept full responsibility for the material submitted.
Unless stated otherwise, all the material displayed on this web site, including all text, photographs, drawings and other images, is copyright and the property of the respective contributor. Registered members are welcome to use it for their own personal non-commercial modelmaking purposes. It must not be reproduced or re-published elsewhere in any form, or used commercially, without first obtaining the owner's express permission.
The owner of this web site may edit, modify or remove any content at any time without giving notice or reason.    © 2008

                 

Recent Topics Back to top of page

Powered by UltraBB 1.15 Copyright © 2007-2011 by Jim Hale and Data 1 Systems. Page design copyright © 2008-2013 Martin Wynne. Photo gallery copyright © 2009 David Williams.