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Deeley 0-6-4T "Flatiron" - Kit Bashing - More Practical Help - Your Model Railway Club
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 Posted: Sun Sep 11th, 2016 11:57 pm
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BCDR
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Hi John,

Looking very good - I liked the bogie bodge.

Nigel



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 Posted: Mon Sep 12th, 2016 12:40 am
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Brossard
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Thanks Nigel, I'm determined to go further than normal with this.  My findings underscore the need for a decent drawing and that kit makers don't necessarily include the correct parts.

John



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 Posted: Tue Sep 13th, 2016 12:20 am
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Brossard
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Another big work session - this time brakes.







The components used for this are from Mainly Trains who do (or did, since they've ceased trading :sad:) these.  The etches have Iain Rices' fingerprints on them.  I'm more and more inclined to confirm the accuracy of parts by referring to the drawing.  In this case, the brakes were spot on.

Brakes themselves are in three parts, body and inner/outer brake shoes- all soldered together.  Care needs to be taken to get the cant of the shoes just so. 

0.032" wire is soldered into holes drilled when the frames were being set up (difficult to get holes in line if you try to do this later).  Brakes were the hung on the wires and soldered in place - roughly at this stage, but as close as possible.

Next I used a Loco Brake Rigging etch and the drawing to try to replicate the arrangement.   I can see one joint has gone ahoo on the top left - tcchhh!.  Easy to fix.  All fiddly stuff.

Final stage is to fine tune the brake shoes.  Obviously these can't touch the wheels, but in addition, the wheels need to come off easily.  This means that the shoes will be more or less in line with the flange rim.  I used a grinding wheel and file for this.

Looking at it, I'm at a loss as to how I'll get the wipers on - ah well - we'll git 'er dun.

John



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 Posted: Tue Sep 13th, 2016 03:02 am
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Marty
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Just catching up John... From what I could see the compensation for the front and middle axle is via a rocker arm? If the front axle is forced up then the middle axle moves down to compensate. Tiny movements of course. Sorry to be a low watt bulb... Just trying to understand what is going on.

And by wipers I'm assuming you mean the strips of metal used to transfer electrical current from the wheels to the motor?

Fascinating as always.

I have a Dapol 45xx in pieces that I intend to rebuild one day... In N gauge!!!



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 Posted: Tue Sep 13th, 2016 03:18 am
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Yes Marty, there is a rocker beam on the front two axles.  This means that the wheels can move in all directions to ensure that they always remain in contact with the track.  Improves adhesion and, of course, electrical pickup.  It's been described as a three legged stool - these never rock.

I've always liked this method, right from the first chassis I built (under the guiding hand of Iain Rice and his Loco Chassis book) - the Bachmann pannier tank.  I've never trusted myself to do a rigid chassis (although with the jig I have that shouldn't be a problem).

Compensation is not that hard - you just have to set things up at the frame stage.

N gauge - ooooh!  I've never worked in that scale - I'm going in the opposite direction.

John



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 Posted: Tue Sep 13th, 2016 03:29 pm
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Marty
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So... Not just front axle and middle axle going up and down but each axle can also roll? That's pretty clever stuff.



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 Posted: Tue Sep 13th, 2016 04:29 pm
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Brossard
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Indeed yes Marty.  Invented by Rod Neep and christened "Flexichas".  The design is reputed to be able to negotiate the worst of track (hopefully mine won't fall into that category).

John



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 Posted: Tue Sep 13th, 2016 05:18 pm
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Hi John,

Wipers - this is where you recall plungers instead of wipers and where some strategic holes in the chassis opposite the rims would save the faff of trying to fit wipers and copper-clad among and between that very nice brake gear (and the gearbox). If space is getting tight under the chassis no reason why the wipers have to be there - there is always the top. Bit more inconvenient but they work just as well.

Nigel



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 Posted: Tue Sep 13th, 2016 05:31 pm
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The thing about plungers Nigel (and both this model and the Austin 7 had them when I got them) is that they are quite fragile.  The spring is very fine and, given the location, they are prone to build up dirt that impedes operation.  Bottom line is that I prefer wire wipers.  At least repairs are straightforward if they become necessary.  With plungers, getting at them for repair, after everything is done is going to be difficult.

I usually try to have one side insulated and the other short to the frames - means only half to effort to install wipers. ;-)

John



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 Posted: Thu Sep 15th, 2016 11:26 pm
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I thought I'd make a start with the body today.  I got the structure mostly done:







It's looking quite rough at the moment and I can see areas where I'll have to use filler.  I used 70C solder to put this together - no worries at all.  I set my iron to 300C.  You can just make out where I filled some dirty great holes with solder.  These locations are for handrails which should be 0.31mm NS wire.  I also broke a rear footstep so will have to figure out how to mend that.  The cast ones aren't that nice anyway.

That smokebox handrail has to go I think, the knobs are way too big.

I'm going to have to devise some way of putting the door handrails in.

John



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 Posted: Fri Sep 16th, 2016 12:24 am
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That's why I haven't put door handrails on mine. Still trying how to do it simply.



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 Posted: Fri Sep 16th, 2016 12:38 am
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The old hands used to use split pins for handrail knobs.  Come to think of it I have a bunch of quite small ones - wonder if they'll do, hmmm :???:.

The instructions you sent me came in handy Mick.  Funny thing, I read through them a couple of times but couldn't find the step that says to join the two sides together. :roll:

John



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 Posted: Fri Sep 16th, 2016 07:50 pm
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I spent quite a bit of time last evening and this morning fettling some of the joints and trying to get the chassis to fit correctly.





The stance looks decidedly off so I'll have to revisit that.

The rear of the chassis hooks over the bar behind the cab doors.  I haven't a clue how to fix the front - maybe I'll just use glue :roll:.

John



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 Posted: Fri Sep 16th, 2016 10:16 pm
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I used a screw through the chimney, mind I was using a Hornby chassis so there was something to screw it to.



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 Posted: Fri Sep 16th, 2016 10:17 pm
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Not quite the same arrangement here Mick.  I haven't even got the chimney I want yet - from AGW.

Anyway, I double checked the ride height and it is correct by scaling the drawing.  The photo is crooked I guess.

Next, I took a look at the buffer beams - yeccchhh!  I thought (perhaps with hubris) that I can do better.

So, again, referring to drawings and photos I made these:



I started with some brass strip from my scrap box.  Getting dimensions from the drawing, I drilled the buffer locations.  Doing the vertical coupling slot is tedious.

Front beam is on the left and rear on the right.  They are quite different with the rear having a beading strip (1mm PB strip) and a horizontal coupling slot.  The support is L section brass strip.

Buffers are Alan Gibson sprung, standard LMS.

My plan is to use Archer rivet transfers to enhance the detail even further.  I'll leave the rest of this towards the end and glue them on as an overlay.

John



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 Posted: Sat Sep 24th, 2016 06:10 pm
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Just wanted to update on my progress.

I've been bashing away at the body and the list of tasks seems endless. Still, I think I'm nearly there.  I'll post some piccies at an appropriate point in the build.

John

 



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 Posted: Sat Sep 24th, 2016 09:37 pm
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As mentioned, I've been trying to make progress on this model.  It has become almost a scratch build using the cast parts as aids.




Progress is quite evident.  Handrails have been installed.  I've started the footsteps but the steps themselves need fitting.  I scraped off the cast boiler bands and used masking tape to reinstate.

The pipe on top of the tank is 2mm brass tube with bits soldered on.  The pipe on the real thing looked wonky as well.

You can see the bogie is on and I was wanting to see how the loco rides.  I had to fit the bunker floor a couple of times before it began to look reasonable.




In this view you can see loops of NS wire for the cab handrails.  What a faff that was!




This view shows the brass bunker floor and frames for the bogie.  It's only tacked at the moment.  There's a nut (10BA I think) soldered to the back of the floor.  The bogie has a slot so that it can pivot and slide.  I also put in a spring.  Again the choice of spring was a matter of trial and error.  The frames were carved from brass sheet and fettled until the wheel flanges were happy.

I got a note from Colin at AGW Monday last to say that my order (including chimney, dome, safety valves and whistle) was being put together.  Haven't heard from him since.

I've also requested a gearbox and motor from High Level since the one that was with this fouls the backhead (chopped out of a Mainline 2P)

John

 



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 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2016 03:00 am
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In keeping with my philosophy of putting projects to one side to fight off the "fed ups" and because I was still waiting for quite a lot of things, I put the whole thing in a box yesterday, and picked up another project, of which more anon.

Wouldn't you know, today my box of goodies arrived from AGW so I now have most of the parts for this and two other locos.  I still need the motor and gearbox from High Level.

John

 



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 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2016 03:38 am
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Hi John,

Fixing the front of the body. Couple of methods.

Tap a hole through the bottom of the smokebox, screw in a long bolt, so that the head and about and inch of thread are left, solder in place, remove head and use a nut and if necessary a washer to secure to the frame (solder in a support with a hole if there isn't one, looks like you have one though). 

Drill and tap a largish piece of brass rod (or tap a brass tube with a thick wall), drill a hole in the bottom of the smokebox and solder in place. Use this to bolt the chassis to the body. This way you won't strip threads in white metal.

Solder a nut to the chassis, long bolt through the chimney.

If you haven't fixed the smoke box door, drill a hole from underneath, pass a bolt through with the head inside the smoke box. Solder in place. Nut (and washer) from underneath the frame carrier.

Nigel

 



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 Posted: Tue Sep 27th, 2016 03:42 am
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Thanks Nigel, some good ideas worth having a think about.  If all else fails I can use contact cement on the front pad.  It holds pretty well once cured but can be prised apart if needs be.

John

 



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