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Scalescenes large station roof - Scalescenes Building Kits. - More Practical Help - Your Model Railway Club
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 Posted: Wed Feb 5th, 2014 02:23 am
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Petermac
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I've been installing some platforms at Maxmill Town terminus station and, as this is to be covered by the Scalescenes large station roof - having been very impressed by John  Dew's Granby roof, I needed to know exactly where to place the outer platforms.

I had the footprint but thought I'd make a start on the roof to be sure the platforms were in the right place.

This will be an "occasional" thread because I'm finishing the third platform at the same time as the roof.

It's taken me over an hour to make one single arch so I shudder to think how long it took you to build your huge roof John. :roll::roll:

It looks like a very nice kit - right up to John Wiffen's usual high standards. :thumbs:thumbs



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 Posted: Fri Feb 7th, 2014 09:33 am
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gdaysydney
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Plenty of photos  Pete  - no pressure at all - :lol:



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 Posted: Fri Feb 7th, 2014 12:55 pm
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Petermac
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You could always look at John Dew's superb build and pretend it's mine Dave .................................:roll::roll::roll::roll:

I'll certainly take photos but I can assure you mine won't come close to John's. :oops:  I would like to try to make the roof panels removable in sections, if possible.  As it is, I think access can only be achieved by lifting the whole structure off the platforms.............:hmm



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 Posted: Fri Feb 7th, 2014 08:09 pm
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John Dew
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Now Peter you flatter me! I still have one module to make but I have to build the station first!

I think the first arch took me about an hour.......after a while you get in a routine.

Some questions:

Will this be straight or curved?  I know at one stage you were thinking of modifying it to be curved.....which is possible but more difficult.

Will you be covering the roof as per John's design or doing as I did and leaving two bays unglazed ?

I did this primarily to improve the view of the interior of the station ......given hindsight I wish I had left a third unglazed
I use the spaces fairly often to insert the hand of god while I am trying to fine tune my stop distances in the bays:oops: 
If your tracks are all  through tracks the question of access is less important but viewing the interior of the station will be very restricted.

How many sections will the roof contain?  They are designed to fit together.......I have 4 in my roof and it is possible to lift it off from time to time.....the problem is where to put it!........but I have only had to do this two or three times in the last two years.
 
One final point.......the side walls to which the arches are glued bear all the weight and tend to splay a little.........this may be exaggerated in my case because there is, at present only one end ........I have fixed sub wall on one side and a couple of piles of luggage on the other so when in position on the platforms the side walls of the roof are slightly compressed to fit within them..........hope that makes sense!  Incidentally I strengthened the the glazed end with a plastistruc beam

Hope this helps!

Kind Regards




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 Posted: Fri Feb 7th, 2014 10:47 pm
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Petermac
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John Dew wrote: Now Peter you flatter me! (I thought it got one everywhere ...:lol:) I still have one module to make but I have to build the station first!

I think the first arch took me about an hour.......after a while you get in a routine.

Some questions:

Will this be straight or curved?  I know at one stage you were thinking of modifying it to be curved.....which is possible but more difficult. (It will be a straight terminus John.  My curved station is elsewhere)

Will you be covering the roof as per John's design or doing as I did and leaving two bays unglazed ? (I had thought of making the roof panels removable - a sort of "box" structure that "plugs" in between the arches and some cross beams I'm going (planning) to put in)

I did this primarily to improve the view of the interior of the station ......given hindsight I wish I had left a third unglazed
I use the spaces fairly often to insert the hand of god while I am trying to fine tune my stop distances in the bays:oops: 
If your tracks are all  through tracks the question of access is less important but viewing the interior of the station will be very restricted. (I'm trying to avoid too much viewing restriction by having the option of opening up the whole of each side's glazed panels  - in "bay long" sections)

How many sections will the roof contain? (Not sure yet - that's why I need to get the last platform done)  They are designed to fit together.......I have 4 in my roof and it is possible to lift it off from time to time.....the problem is where to put it!........but I have only had to do this two or three times in the last two years.
 
One final point.......the side walls to which the arches are glued bear all the weight and tend to splay a little.........this may be exaggerated in my case because there is, at present only one end ........I have fixed sub wall on one side and a couple of piles of luggage on the other so when in position on the platforms the side walls of the roof are slightly compressed to fit within them..........hope that makes sense! (It does indeed John so I'm going to see if I can make the "shell" a fixture and remove the panels.  I also plan to have spacer beams from arch to arch)  Incidentally I strengthened the the glazed end with a plastistruc beam

Hope this helps!  (Yes John, it does - as does your very useful "Guinea Pig" thread elsewhere on here.  :cheers:cheers)

Kind Regards





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 Posted: Fri Feb 7th, 2014 11:56 pm
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John Dew
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Petermac wrote: John Dew wrote:  (It does indeed John so I'm going to see if I can make the "shell" a fixture and remove the panels.  I also plan to have spacer beams from arch to arch)  Incidentally I strengthened the the glazed end with a plastistruc beam



Good idea :thumbs  I was going to mention tha t:oops: and then thought I would save it for another post as I was listing too many things. I made mine with card and clad them with some of printed stuff from the ends........plastic might be better


Removeable glazing ..........nothing like a challenge:roll:  I will be watching with interest


:cheers



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 Posted: Sat Feb 8th, 2014 12:46 am
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Petermac
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John Dew wrote: ......................................................


Removeable glazing ..........nothing like a challenge:roll:  I will be watching with interest


:cheers

Watching isn't going to do me much good John - what I need is engineering input ...........:lol::lol::cheers:cheers:cheers:cheers

I haven't, as yet, read the instructions beyond the "arch construction" ........:oops::oops::oops: so don't really know how the glazing fits.

What I thought I might be able to do is make the glazing panels into little "plug in" upside down "boxes".  The glazing is the base of the box and the sides would be constructed from card and this "box", when tipped bottom up (i.e. the glazing uppermost as it should be) would form the "plug".  The "socket" would be formed by the arches and my added longitudinal beams between them.  A sort of square "bottle stopper".

If I could draw, you'd understand in 2 seconds flat :brickwall  Unfortunately, I can't draw ..........:???:



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 Posted: Sat Feb 8th, 2014 03:44 am
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Petermac wrote:
I haven't, as yet, read the instructions beyond the "arch construction" ........:oops::oops::oops: so don't really know how the glazing fits.


:hmm



Reading thru it is worthwhile!


Having checked downstairs and looked at the photos I now realise you could box the glazing because unlike the roofing its not curved but I dont think it will solve either the viewing or the occasional access

These photos may help

The end two sections are how it is designed

The two sections nearest the camera show my modification so I can admire the station detail and more importantly gently insert a hand without having to move the entire structure (I only did this on the near side.....the window side is fully covered))
 











Having dug out these photos I am immediately reminded of two things

[1] Predetermine how many sections you will need and print everything out.....unlike me......that way you will avoid the shade mismatch

[2] Each section has its own support wall.....thus there are 4 individual support walls above.....the little pillars hide the join and on the other side a single arch shared by two sections.........you can actually see the offset on the first arch (bottom left above) waiting for the final section

This is a major weak spot and the trick if you are doing more than one section (which you are) is to offset the inner wall so you actually laminate the entire wall in one session rather than make 4 individual sections.......I worked this out a bit late but I did the far wall that way and it makes for a far stronger construction







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 Posted: Sat Feb 8th, 2014 04:23 am
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Petermac wrote: What I thought I might be able to do is make the glazing panels into little "plug in" upside down "boxes".  The glazing is the base of the box and the sides would be constructed from card and this "box", when tipped bottom up (i.e. the glazing uppermost as it should be) would form the "plug".  The "socket" would be formed by the arches and my added longitudinal beams between them.  A sort of square "bottle stopper".

If I could draw, you'd understand in 2 seconds flat :brickwall  Unfortunately, I can't draw ..........:???:

I take it you mean something similar to this Peter...??


Cheers, Gary.



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 Posted: Sat Feb 8th, 2014 12:09 pm
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Petermac
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Many thanks Gary - can you cook too ? :thumbs:thumbs:thumbs

That's exactly what I meant but, having looked at Johns latest photos, I think I may have to enlarge the "plug" to encompass a whole bay.  As he said, just taking the glazing out would make very little difference to the view. :hmm



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 Posted: Sat Feb 8th, 2014 01:03 pm
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Hi Peter

No photo's yet !!! :lol:

When I get round to building mine, I was intending to fit a camera (probably a raspberry pi-cam) in the roof space looking down on the track ends, so that I see the uncoupling, and the buffer stops. (John - I'm still trying to train my thumb, never mind a PC to stop in the right place).
Raspberry Pi £19 - £27 (depending on model), Pi-Cam £20 capable of 1080p at 30fps, 720p at 60fps
The camera only weighs 3g.

For the walls, I intended to insert bamboo barbeque skewers into each pillar, extending beyond the base an inch or so (probably 2" to allow the skewer to pass through the platform and into the baseboard. The holes in the platform/baseboard being lined with a straw. The straw is a loose fit on the skewer, so should cope with my drilling standards and measuring skills. :roll:

Paul






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 Posted: Sat Feb 8th, 2014 03:05 pm
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I suppose a piccy says a thousdand words - just knocked up a prototype using the standard station roof supports.



A pencil sharpener provides the point.

I will also be able to make a jig for the pins to insert into so that all of my arches are the same distance apart at the base.

Paul



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 Posted: Sat Feb 8th, 2014 03:20 pm
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Petermac
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A "plug in" station Paul - that'll be one up on my roof panels .............:thumbs:thumbs



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 Posted: Sun Feb 9th, 2014 03:01 am
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Just out of curiosity, how thick are the post sections of the overall roof ?

Cheers, Gary.



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 Posted: Sun Feb 9th, 2014 07:36 am
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Hi Peter
I also have Scalescenes excellent overall station roof kit, but I just couldn't see how it would work with my track layout. In a thread about 3d printing I mentioned that someone was trying to sell me a printer and I have to confess I succumbed. 

I'm prototyping the development of a system for constructing platform canopies and station roofs, using my layout needs as the initial driver, with the intention of eventually making the components available on line via Shapeways. Sort of like a grown ups lego with glue instead of the little dots.
Here is picture out of my software showing an indication of how it could go together.


 
And here is a typical component.




Don't mean to hijack your Scalescenes thread and I hope no one sees this a "commercial plug" because at this time nothing is available for sale.  I'm still using a lot of Scalescenes in my station, but hopefully using plastic to do the things I couldn't do with card.



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 Posted: Sun Feb 9th, 2014 01:11 pm
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Petermac
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Gary, the arches are made up by laminating 3 pieces of 2mm card and 2 of 1mm so 8mm in total. :thumbs

Peter, those canopy supports look great and, at the right price, would sell well IMHO.  The Scalelink offerings are excellent but I suspect lack structural strength being a single thin brass etching and are difficult to solder up.  The only other real option I've seen is from York Modelmaking - laser cut card, but the price is high if you need a lot of them.  That's where 3D comes into it's own - a one off is expensive but, once the design work has been paid for, it's just printer time and resin cost - plus of course, your margin. :cheers

Keep us informed of developments please. :thumbs



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Further to John's comments in post #8, I too will need 4 sections.  Actually, slightly less but I can move the goods shed further back to make space for a full 4 sections.  Unless the roof is fairly long, I think it looks too "stubby" given the width of the thing.

Here's a couple of shots showing where it will go:



The last platform will go where the wood block is on the right.  The drawn line will be the outer wall.  The goods shed (not actually that one but a similar one), was originally closer to the foreground but where it now is, will allow 4 roof sections to be fitted.  The track running through the goods shed will therefore, be cut back to where the gap is in the sleepers on that track.   The card back in the foreground is where the station concours will start.  I plan to kitbash the Scalescenes large station building to fit the available space - probably 2 of their large clock towers rather than just the one but that's for tomorrow.................:roll::roll:



This shot gives a better perspective of the site. Just between the Class 08 shunter (the yellow square beyond the good shed) and the Lenz hand throttle you can just see,  are the coal drops.  Access to this "lower" yard is by passing the right hand side of the goods shed - on the extreme edge of the baseboard.



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 Posted: Sun Feb 9th, 2014 03:24 pm
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Hi Peter
Great to see some decent length platforms. What sort of length trains are you planning to run? I was originally intending to run 8 carriage trains, but even though I have a couple of platforms that will accommodate them, other track layout limitations have made me have to settle for six max.

You can get a sneak preview of how things are shaping up at Shapeways here. https://www.shapeways.com/shops/modelrail 
Sorry...it's too late at night for me to code in the hyperlink properly.




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Thanks Peter.

From what I have read about the amount of weight on the pillars and how they tend to be pushed outwards, would it be wise to have the arches cut from 6mm perspex ?? This then could be laminated with the detailed printed layer. Just a thought ! ;-)

Cheers, Gary.



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Oh it did the hyperlink for me :)



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