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Silo HO Scale - Scratchbuilding. - More Practical Help - Your Model Railway Club
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 Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 01:11 am
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Wayne Williams
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The Silo build is done! Well, just the building part. The painting is just beginning, albeit slowly.

I have capped the roof with a ridge cap, then took the next three pictures.





Now, I have played around with mixing colors up to try and match the concrete color of the actual Silo. :evil: :evil: :evil: Definitely not an easy thing to do. I just compared the colors of the patches in this photo to the actual card, surprisingly they look very similar. :shock:
You can see in this photo the joint lines I have painted. they were painted first and allowed to dry. I just painted the whole card and then immediately wiped off everything I could.

If you would number the patches from the upper left going down, the best match seems to be something between 2 and 3. I also tried dry brushing dark and light colors over the dried patches in an attempt to give is a textured look.

My feelings ..... I failed miserably! :twisted: :twisted: :twisted: I am not happy with how the scribed lines are showing, especially in number 3, which was probably the closest match. I choose not to use black to fill in the scribe lines, perhaps that was an incorrect decision. I also do not like the textured look, does not look "To Scale" to me, too large of a texture!



I will post this and then go and get a picture of the actual concrete to post. Maybe that will help everyone tell me what I'm doing wrong!

Wayne



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 Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 01:13 am
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Wayne Williams
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Here is a photo of the actual concrete.



Wayne



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 Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 08:29 am
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Bob K
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Wayne

My advice is not to be too concerned with finding exact matches. The effect of scale will make the model look darker even if you use exact colours. You should consider that you are looking at the object at a distance and, as we all know, things look more pale the further away they are. If you can walk away from the real object and see what it looks like at 'scale' distance.

From further away you will also get a feel as to whether the texture would really be visible and my insticts tell me that the concrete panels would look quite smooth, albeit considerably weathered.

I think you have to take the view "if looks right then it is right"- a saying so often used on this forum.

Best of luck though.

Bob(K)

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 Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 10:20 am
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Petermac
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Wayne - you're clearly a perfectionist !!!!!

To me, the paint job looks wonderful and, as Novice said, there are some things you just CAN'T scale down.

As far as colour/texture is concerned, whilst I can't actually SEE the texture, either the middle or bottom test on the left look just about spot on !!

A really fantastic build. :wink: :wink:

Petermac



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 Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 12:42 pm
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Wayne Williams
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Novice and Petermac, Thank You for the advice. I think you are both right, I am being too particular. And Yes I have been accused of being a "Perfectionist" before. :shock: :shock: :shock: :D

OK, I will accept the patch number 2 or 3, as far as color and texture is concerned, probably leaning towards number 2 as it is a little lighter in color, based upon Bob(K)'s advice on scale color. I do want to see if I can make the scribe lines show up just a little bit more though. :evil:

Now the next problem is recreating that same patch again.!!! :shock: :? :roll: :D :lol:

Wayne



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 Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 01:30 pm
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Paul Williams
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Wayne As it appears we are taking a straw Poll on this. I vote for number 2.
Once applied I believe it will look very close to the original silo.
I'm impressed with the concrete color you have come up with. As you know I have expressed concern in the past about finding a concrete color. Looking forward to seeing the finished product.

DAD

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 Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 04:42 pm
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I don't think you are doing anything wrong, Wayne.

A little more experimantation and you will get the result you want I'm sure. Did you thin the paint before use? It's hard to tell on the photo, but I wondered if the paint was a little too thick. I don't mean applied too thickly - maybe just not thinned enough to give good smooth coverage. Two or three thin coats are far better than one thick one.

Perry



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 Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 11:36 pm
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Wayne Williams
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Perry wrote:I don't think you are doing anything wrong, Wayne.

A little more experimantation and you will get the result you want I'm sure. Did you thin the paint before use? It's hard to tell on the photo, but I wondered if the paint was a little too thick. I don't mean applied too thickly - maybe just not thinned enough to give good smooth coverage. Two or three thin coats are far better than one thick one.

Perry



:oops: :oops: :oops: Thin the paint?????? :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: Me, forget!!!!! :oops: :oops: :oops:

I think I will try ONE more test panel!

Wayne :shock: :roll: :oops: :lol:



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 Posted: Tue Feb 5th, 2008 11:55 pm
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:oops: :oops: :oops: Thin the paint?????? :oops: :oops: :oops: :oops: Me, forget!!!!! :oops: :oops: :oops:

I think I will try ONE more test panel!

Wayne :shock: :roll: :oops: :lol:

Wayne, don't concern yourself about forgetting - happens to the best of us.
I reset a decoder & forgot the reset loco number of 3 - I thought I had blown up a chip as it did not respond when I punched in the loco number on the side of the cab :oops: :lol: :oops:

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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 12:07 am
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Marty
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Wayne,

Once you have put your base concrete coat on I would still try a light wash of either a slightly darker grey or a slightly lighter one. The wash will settle into the grooves and corners giving the paint job some depth.

Practice the wash on your spare bit you are using, I'm sure you'll work it out.
cheers



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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 12:08 am
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Wayne Williams
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I should have said, you have to Know something before you can say you forgot it!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:

One thing about all this, I shouldn't and probably won't forget it again!

What do they say, "Fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me!!"

Maybe not quite appropriate, but you get the gist of it. :shock:

Wayne



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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 01:58 am
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Wayne Williams
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OK, everyone, get your good eyeglasses on and let me know what you think about this painting test.
The scribe lines were painted with black with a little Country Grey mixed in. Immediately wiped back off with a paper towel, then dried.

Formula for first coat: 3 drops of Country Grey Plus: 1 drop of Ivory White Plus: 1/2 drop of Honeycomb (Brown) Plus: water (See Below). All water was applied using a #2 artist brush dipped in a glass of water and held over the paint until one drop fell off (or was shook off) :smile:

Patch number 1 has 2 drops of water
Patch number 2 has 4 drops of water
Patch number 3 has 6 drops of water

My observations: Patch number 3 looks the best, and was much easier to apply.



Formula for second coat: 3 drops of Country Grey Plus: 1 drop of Ivory White Plus: 1/2 drop of Honeycomb (Brown) Plus: water (See Below).

Patch numbers 1, 2, and 3 each have 6 drops of water added (learned my lesson fast)

My observations: All three were easy to apply, and number 3 still look the best.



Formula for third coat: 3 drops of Country Grey Plus: 1 drop of Ivory White Plus: 1/2 drop of Honeycomb (Brown) Plus: water (See Below).

Patch numbers 1, 2, and 3 each have 6 drops of water added

My observations: All three were easy to apply, and number 3 still look the best. However I think it looked better on the previous picture (only two coats of paint).


Texture coat:
I took a cheap 1" brush and cut the bristles down to about half their length. The bristles are now very "stiff".

1 drop of Country Grey, brushed out on a paper plate to about a 1" circle.
I dabbed the cut off brush (hereinafter called texture brush) into the 1" circle, then tried to dab off most of the paint on a clean spot of the paper plate. Then dry jabbed the brush onto all the test patches.

I repeated this process for Ivory white, and Honeycomb (brown), not waiting for anything to dry.

1 drop of black mixed with a small dab of Country Grey, brushed out into a 1" circle on the paper plate. Then dry jabbed the brush onto all the test patches.





It was dark outside during the entire time of the test, and I did not change the lighting for any of the photos. The second photo for whatever reason looks lighter, but I don't know why.

Based upon my observation of the third patch looking better after only two coats, I now feel that I will probably do this over again using more water. OK Perry, go ahead and say it! :roll: :lol:

Well, what do YOU think?

Wayne



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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 02:42 am
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Sol
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Wayne, to my un-trained eye, patch 2 , 2nd coat looks good & for the textured, same patch 2.

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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 03:09 am
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Good to see you're experimenting, Wayne.
I prefer the non-textured versions, such as trial #3, photo #2, [as you mentioned] I have doubts about the scale of any texture. But that's me.

If you're using gesso as your white, it should take thin, runny stains really well, and if you're also planning to use chalks they should adhere well.

Mike

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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 03:16 am
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Marty
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Top job Wayne, I think that number 3 Textured is the best.

Have you tried a medium gray wash over the texture?

I don't think putting the black/gray wash on first works as the concrete coat hides the wash, from what I can tell from the photo anyway.



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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 03:55 am
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phill
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Not done this type of painting before but i think No3 looks the best to me.
Phill

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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 09:18 am
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No. 3 for me too Wayne - the others just look a tad "pale".

Re the "texture" - as I've said before, we can't actually SEE it but, what we do see is the slight "speckling" effect which, to me. DOES look like the imperfections in concrete blocks. It's that effect that makes it for me rather than any "roughness". You don't want the thing to look "pock-marked" but I do like the flecks.

Petermac



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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 10:39 am
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If that was "0" gauge the texturing would be great but "N", I don't think it looks right - I'm sure if you were to scale up those "lumps" you would find them oversized. Having said that I so much admire the trouble you are taking to get this right and the saying "It's a wise man who looks things over, instead of overlooking things" comes immediately to mind.
Ken.



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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 11:24 am
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vinny
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Wayne-the best for me was in the 1st set of pics,last pic,2nd down. That looked spot on :D :D

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 Posted: Wed Feb 6th, 2008 02:07 pm
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Wayne Williams
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Thank you one and all for your comments. Much appreciated!

Ken, Just so you know, this is HO Scale, not N scale, and I do agree with your comment about the "Scale of the texture". Applying the texture is very difficult in that it is hard to control the size of the "Spot". When I have done it exactly right I can barely see the texture with the naked eye. That said, I am working on ways to apply it, very patiently and quite slowly as far as not building it up so fast. If I can "see it going on", then I am doing it too much and too fast. Practice makes perfect!

Petermac, texture may have been the wrong word for me to use. What you are seeing is indeed "speckling". The surface is still smooth to the touch.

Marty, "Have you tried a medium gray wash over the texture?" Never gave a thought of doing anything over the texture Marty, but now that you have said it, maybe it would reduce the boldness of the texture, which could only be a good thing in my mind. Thanks! (I can see another test coming!) :D

MikeC, :oops: :oops: :oops: I made a point of going out and buying the white gesso too, just completely forgot to use it!!! Do you think it will change anything that I have done so far? Or is it's use strictly for good adhesion? Am I thinking right in that the white gesso would be the very first coat on the silo? Then the second coat would be the black wipe for the scribe lines over the dried white gesso?

How many times do you test? As far as I'm concerned as long as I feel I am making progress with the testing, it will continue. This Silo, in my humble opinion, looks great, but with the wrong "Paint Job" it would be ruined.

Wayne :lol:



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