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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 12:43 pm
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allan downes
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What defeated me when I first started out in this hobby wasn't so much of how how to cut a sheet of cardboard in half, but what to do with it when I had.

Well it's taken me the best part of a lifetime in trying to find out - and even now I don't know all the answers, and I doubt that I ever will but, over the years this hobby, and one that makes a carpenter, an electrician, an engineer, a landscapist, artist, architect, photographer and all else required of us to build even the smallest little  'end to end- it has also provided me with a good living and it would be nice to offer something back in return.

So while I don't propose to know all the answers, at least I can offer the answers that I do, or to put it another way, the answers that worked for me. , therefore if anyone thinks that I may be of help, then by all means please ask and I shall do my best to be of any possible assistance.

Allan. 


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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 12:49 pm
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ddolfelin
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Look out for a 6' x 3' parcel in the post, Allan.

I'm joking - but what a nice offer.
I'd be proud to state 'Assisted by Allan Downes' on work of mine.



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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 01:04 pm
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allan downes
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ddolfelin wrote:
I'd be proud to state 'Assisted by Allan Downes' on work of mine.

Do that DD, and you'll de value it by half!

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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 02:18 pm
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rhiwderin_ray
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What a wonderful offer Allan !
I find it easy to build card kits and have tried to build a station building using embossed plastic card glued to foamboard and windows from an old Hornby station kit with reasonable success.
I think the main issue most modellers will have is in painting correctly, weathering without overdoing it and what fine detail should be added to make a building more realistic.
Any tips and trics on these topics would be most welcome!



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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 02:25 pm
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Marty
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Thank you Allan, that is very kind. I can't ask it now as I don't have the supporting photos loaded.... Nor the building shell finished for that fact, but there will be a "help" coming your way in due course.



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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 03:00 pm
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allan downes
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rhiwderin_ray wrote: What a wonderful offer Allan !
I find it easy to build card kits and have tried to build a station building using embossed plastic card glued to foamboard and windows from an old Hornby station kit with reasonable success.
I think the main issue most modellers will have is in painting correctly, weathering without overdoing it and what fine detail should be added to make a building more realistic.
Any tips and trics on these topics would be most welcome!

Hi Ray.

Starting out with cardboard kits is the best learning curve possible - all your dimensions are there, construction guide, everything that you will want to know when it comes to scratchbuilding for the first time, and if I were to be honest - and a first for me! - when I first started out I built the entire SUPERQUICK range - badly!

The thing to remember Ray, is that the camera doesn't lie, and if, as I do, you work for the camera and for example,and remember that that loose hair that is now embedded for life in your model that you thought nobody would ever notice, it now suddenly becomes the size of mooring rope after it's been photographed, then this alone will teach you more than any tutor ever will!

Detailing is one thing that I was very lazy at as I built for the 'whole' and not for the 'part' - Often I have stood amongst the crowd at exhibitions listening to the comments about my layout and generaly folk would walk staight past hundreds of hours of tiling and detailing just to stand by a tunnel portal waiting for the next train to come out - I might just as well have stuck empty Cornflakes boxes every where!

However, there are two what I regard as the two most important aspects of a building - the roof because it is the largest single expanse on the model, and the windows that are usually the only engineered fittings where the rest is represented by bricks floating on a bed of mortar and the older the building, the more it leans - but not the windows.

Detailing of course today is made a lot easier thanks to WILLS detailing packs which cover every aspect that you can think of and, of course, there's SCALELINK that offer a vast range of brass etched attatchments from working door latches through to etched tree leaves! you name it, they provide it.

So Ray, I hope that helps.

Best regards.

Allan.

 

 

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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 05:57 pm
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Ken
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For real satisfaction there's nothing to compare with scratchbuilding - or do I mean my buildings should all be scratched?!!! :lol::lol:  Joking apart what a nice offer Allan and I'm sure many of us will take advantage of it.

Ken.



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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 06:20 pm
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Chinahand
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That's a really generous offer Alan though it might be one you come to regret. :mutley

One thing I've always puzzled over is what adhesive(s) to use when using a mixture of materials. e.g. Card structure, etched brass windows and white metal & Plasticard detailing bits so I, for one, would appreciate the benefits of your experience in this particular regard. I generally use Evo-stick woodworking adhesive for card-to-card and Evo-stick contact adhesive for the other bits. I've tried varous cyanocrylate glues but with mixed success.

Any comments you might have on my latest offering would also be appreciated http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=9987&forum_id=21&page=9



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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 06:41 pm
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rhiwderin_ray
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Many thanks Allan for sharing your knowledge.



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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 07:16 pm
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Hi Allan and thank you for the offer.i'm sure i will make use of it at sometime. i started with metcalfe and progressed to scalescenes.i have built some scenics from scratch but don't know if that's classed as scratchbuilding.there are some photos on my Ilsham valley railway thread.ie,the tunnel/hill and the embankment.



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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 07:31 pm
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allan downes
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Chinahand wrote: That's a really generous offer Alan though it might be one you come to regret. :mutley

One thing I've always puzzled over is what adhesive(s) to use when using a mixture of materials. e.g. Card structure, etched brass windows and white metal & Plasticard detailing bits so I, for one, would appreciate the benefits of your experience in this particular regard. I generally use Evo-stick woodworking adhesive for card-to-card and Evo-stick contact adhesive for the other bits. I've tried varous cyanocrylate glues but with mixed success.

Any comments you might have on my latest offering would also be appreciated http://yourmodelrailway.net/view_topic.php?id=9987&forum_id=21&page=9



Hi Trevor.

Right. Glues.

What you have to remember is that once a building is assembled, that's it - you can't get inside anymore to maybe reposition a slipped window for example or because the building is coming apart at the corners because you  didn't glue them together well enough so-

If using card, I 'pin' the building together AFTER I have done everything possible to it, in sections and flat down on the table.

Then once satisfied, and for speed and INSTANT hold, I run a thick fillet of thick SUPERGLUE down the inside of each corner joint, check it for square, then give it a blast of accelerator - WHAM! -  instant rock hard joint that is NEVER going to come apart - even if you try sawing it!

If you are using brass etched windows, or any windows come to that, smear the inner window apertures with EVOSTICK IMPACT, position each window one at a time and hold permanantly in place with either a dab or two of superglue or just strips of masking tape around all edges. Then fix the glazing - a min thickness of 1 mil - again using EVOSTIK IMPACT or a dab of SUPERGLUE.

If you're building the entire building out of STYRENE, then of course you can use a SOLVENT glue for main assemble - MEKPAK or PLASTICWELD - then back up the joint with thick SUPERGLUE as you would with card.

Now, this is very important, pencil at the ready! - right, when you fix the base plate into the building, ALWAYS cut a 2" square hole in it to allow ALL the glues to ventilate - If you DON'T - the glazing will  mist over and apart from taking the building apart, there is absolutely nothing that you can do about it - I know, cos it's happened to me - a massive factory and 40 or more windows! (kinda looked good though...)

Where individual card roof tiles are concerned I just use neat PVA  but - NEVER use PVA, or ANY water based glue to stick brickpapers to either card or styrene - it will simply bubble up, crease up, or just tear as you try to position it. So always use EVOSTIK IMPACT by applying a generouse coat to the building wall, then offer up the brickwork/stonework sheeting whilst the glue is still wet and carefully adjust - no tears, no tears!

Had a look at your buildings Trevor - most definately on the right track. Just keep an eye on the proportions and 'easy' on the chimney 'sailing' courses other wise, damn good stuff!

Best regards.

Allan

 

 

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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 07:33 pm
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allan downes
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rhiwderin_ray wrote: Many thanks Allan for sharing your knowledge.
My pleasure Ray.

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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 07:41 pm
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allan downes
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spurno wrote: Hi Allan and thank you for the offer.i'm sure i will make use of it at sometime. i started with metcalfe and progressed to scalescenes.i have built some scenics from scratch but don't know if that's classed as scratchbuilding.there are some photos on my Ilsham valley railway thread.ie,the tunnel/hill and the embankment.

Hi ALAN.

Look foreward to seeing some of your work - anything that doesn't come in a box and you have built it - is scratchbuilt, so join the club!

One day I'll tell you about the disasters I had when commissioned to build a layout entirely out of card kits - It looked like a Kintergarden project by the time I had finished!!

Best regards.

Allan

 

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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 07:44 pm
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Chinahand
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Many thanks Allan.

Your comment about NOT using PVA for fixing brick paper is interesting. I generally use 50:50 diluted PVA for that and brush it thinly onto the card. Wait a few moments for it to start to go tacky and then apply the brickpaper, starting at one edge and rolling it out onto the pre-glued card. So far no bubbles, touch wood.



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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 07:50 pm
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allan downes
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Chinahand wrote: Many thanks Allan.

Your comment about NOT using PVA for fixing brick paper is interesting. I generally use 50:50 diluted PVA for that and brush it thinly onto the card. Wait a few moments for it to start to go tacky and then apply the brickpaper, starting at one edge and rolling it out onto the pre-glued card. So far no bubbles, touch wood.

Yes, another way of diong it Trevor, which just goes to show that my way's not the only way - why do you think I started up this Thread? - to nick other peoples ideas of course!

Regards, and thanks for the tip!

Allan.

 

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 Posted: Fri Mar 15th, 2013 09:01 pm
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With downloaded brick/stone/tile papers I normally print to A4 label stock (1 A4 sized label per sheet) I've used both paper and vinyl stock. I work in N gauge so A4 is plenty large enough for the majority of projects.

For joining parts  I use either Ebvostik "serious glue" or super glue. For strengthening I often use styrene angle or square section at corners, also sometimes foamboard as floor or ceiling and, probably overkill, ground to roof "room dividers" on larger structures. On a few occasions I have also used a hot melt glue gun.

On card chimneys I squeeze in some modelling putty then cut pots from styrene tube,  and push them into the putty, cover the top of the brick or stone with some suitably drilled card or pastic, that helps hold the pots in place while the putty sets, the card chimney will probably tear off the roof before the pots get knocked over.



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 Posted: Tue Mar 19th, 2013 12:02 pm
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rhiwderin_ray
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Hi Allan
May I ask as to how you go about converting a real building into a model.
e.g. Do you measure from photos or real life? How do you choose which materials to use for certain bits of the building, etc.What additional flaps are required for joining pieces, etc
Sorry if this covers too much!



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 Posted: Tue Mar 19th, 2013 12:53 pm
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Moved to the Scratchbuilding Forum.



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 Posted: Tue Mar 19th, 2013 01:07 pm
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allan downes
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rhiwderin_ray wrote: Hi Allan
May I ask as to how you go about converting a real building into a model.
e.g. Do you measure from photos or real life? How do you choose which materials to use for certain bits of the building, etc.What additional flaps are required for joining pieces, etc
Sorry if this covers too much!

Hi Ray.

Knowing the general size of leading dimensions of course does help - Room hieghts, ground to windows, door sizes, really and again, a question of what makes sense, looks in scale, and looks right.

Yes, I do work from photographs where once again it's a matter of judgement and if I'm only using a building for its design and not nescessary as a accurate representation, then it doesn't really matter about arriving at exact dimensions - its the design I'm interested in, not how large it is.

Choosing materials depends on what you're trying to achieve but usually all base construction materials - normally card in my case - will be covered anyway with whatever wall finish you choose.

Detailing work like bay windows, doors, ornamental detail like gorbels etc, then styrene is by far the best material. 

Not quite sure Ray what you mean by "additional flaps" but if you mean how do I join two sheets of material together, then I would glue a substantial backing strip over the joints at the back.

Hope this is of help.

Allan

 

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 Posted: Tue Mar 19th, 2013 02:04 pm
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rhiwderin_ray
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Thanks Allan, you picked up exactly on what I meant by flaps, etc.



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